This is great info. Suppose the octane ratings are similar between a race gas and something like an E85 mix... Is there any timing being pulled/added just based on the fact that it is a different AFR?
AFRs will be the same as the ECU doesn't know the fuel is different. But with more Ethanol you are a little leaner, closer to optimized combustion. Both should have plenty of octane especially if you use a little race in your E blend. Higher octane you can run more boost and timing. The higher maps give you that.
I understand a lot of people believe that. And don't get me wrong E85 is great stuff especially applications where you can get away with straight E85 because it's relatively high octane and cheap. And the extra fuel volume required provides EGT benefits all else being equal.
I've got plenty of really high HP cars and switch between race gas and E85 on them often. I'll take good unleaded racing fuel like GT260+ or MS109 any day on most of them for several reasons. The octane is higher and while you don't get the same EGT benefits normally on those platforms EGT isn't a huge factory anyway. Main benefit is you can push more power through the fuel system all else being equal. Most good race fuel is oxygenated to start and the lower fuel volume required also means more space in those cylinders for extra air/oxygen.
As for the Stinger specifically straight race gas is better than E30 IMHO. It would be equivalent to E50 but the latter stresses the factory high pressure pump due to the higher required injection volume so you wind up having to lower performance to run it.
I understand a lot of people believe that. And don't get me wrong E85 is great stuff especially applications where you can get away with straight E85 because it's relatively high octane and cheap. And the extra fuel volume required provides EGT benefits all else being equal.
I've got plenty of really high HP cars and switch between race gas and E85 on them often. I'll take good unleaded racing fuel like GT260+ or MS109 any day on most of them for several reasons. The octane is higher and while you don't get the same EGT benefits normally on those platforms EGT isn't a huge factory anyway. Main benefit is you can push more power through the fuel system all else being equal.
As for the Stinger specifically straight race gas is better than E30 IMHO. It would be equivalent to E50 but the latter stresses the factory high pressure pump due to the higher required injection volume so you wind up having to lower performance to run it.
Seems on the Stingers current tunes e has the edge since we can't take advantage of 100 octane fully with our 21 psi ecu cap.
Little race little E seems like a good mix.
Seems on the Stingers current tunes e has the edge since we can't take advantage of 100 octane fully with our 21 psi ecu cap.
Little race little E seems like a good mix.
I keep hearing about this boost cap from Tork.. They know we tuned the Pure hybrid car to 28psi right? There is no boost cap beyond the factory turbo limitations lol.
To max out power on E85 you'll also need WMI or CPI to supplement fuel volume as it takes around E50 to get there. At least on our development car.
I will look to see if I can any decent E85 around here. I think we are going to Atco if the weather holds up. Anyone know a place with decent E85 in that area?
I keep hearing about this boost cap from Tork.. They know we tuned the Pure hybrid car to 28psi right? There is no boost cap beyond the factory turbo limitations lol.
To max out power on E85 you'll also need WMI or CPI to supplement fuel volume as it takes around E50 to get there. At least on our development car.
Maybe its something in his tune. But I've yet to see a stock turbo sustain 22 psi with out ecu intervention. (Lap3 wmi tune 21.7)
I assume getstungs throttle closure mid gear (not the throttle closure on shifts) was this same torque limit.
Not sure how it worked on the hybrid turbo car but the results where disapointing, ETs like stock turbos but with better traps.
I will look to see if I can any decent E85 around here. I think we are going to Atco if the weather holds up. Anyone know a place with decent E85 in that area?
This will be my first time going to Atco. I live a lot closer to Cecil County so that is where I started, but the only test'n'tune nights they have are on Wednesdays.
This will be my first time going to Atco. I live a lot closer to Cecil County so that is where I started, but the only test'n'tune nights they have are on Wednesdays.
Maybe its something in his tune. But I've yet to see a stock turbo sustain 22 psi with out ecu intervention. (Lap3 wmi tune 21.7)
I assume getstungs throttle closure mid gear (not the throttle closure on shifts) was this same torque limit.
Not sure how it worked on the hybrid turbo car but the results where disapointing, ETs like stock turbos but with better traps.
The "limit" you're all running against is just the factory turbos. lap runs more boost with their larger turbos. With the pure car it hit ~127mph traps on a so-so track while one else has even sniffed within 5mph of that at quicker tracks. But it takes more than just power to run a lower ET.
The "limit" you're all running against is just the factory turbos. lap runs more boost with their larger turbos. With the pure car it hit ~127mph traps on a so-so track while one else has even sniffed within 5mph of that at quicker tracks. But it takes more than just power to run a lower ET.
If the limit was just the factory turbos wouldn't we just make heat and no more power? There is something that cuts timimg and closes the throttle and thats not the turbos doing that.
Take down an RWD or two in the cooler weather and get an AWD back in the #1 or #2 spot! I can get into the 11.7s with LC but wont be seeing 11.5s until i get the snip working or some really cold temps.
If the limit was just the factory turbos wouldn't we just make heat and no more power? There is something that cuts timimg and closes the throttle and thats not the turbos doing that.
Sure running over the flash boost target will result in proportional throttle closure. With the JB4 you can limit how much boost the ECU sees to keep it below that target though while actual boost can be much higher. Which is why we're able to hit 27psi+ on the Pure turbo car despite the flash map only targeting around 18psi.
Like anything it's a details business though. You'd need to look at the specific details of what you're trying to do. There are certainly other reasons some people can't run over 20psi including fuel pressure tanking, insufficient octane, in some cases WGDC limiters in place, etc.
Just comical to me that people who are supposed to know better still believe there is "lots of power" to be unlocked if they could only run their stock turbos over 20psi... lol.
Sure running over the flash boost target will result in proportional throttle closure. With the JB4 you can limit how much boost the ECU sees to keep it below that target though while actual boost can be much higher. Which is why we're able to hit 27psi+ on the Pure turbo car despite the flash map only targeting around 18psi.
Like anything it's a details business though. You'd need to look at the specific details of what you're trying to do. There are certainly other reasons some people can't run over 20psi including fuel pressure tanking, insufficient octane, in some cases WGDC limiters in place, etc.
Just comical to me that people who are supposed to know better still believe there is "lots of power" to be unlocked if they could only run their stock turbos over 20psi... lol.
I tried hiding a little boost with the jb4 but same behavior. Ecu only saw 17 or 18 psi and still pulled timimg immediately across the board from 14 to 6, but no throttle close. Fuel pressure 12, 95 and trims 27. Boost dropped 2 psi and ignition came back up. This doesn't sound like any of the above causes.
That one timing drop you had in high gear? You'll recall at the time I think there is a problem with a torque limiter in your specific flash map there. If you were hitting a "boost cap" you'd have boost reduced not timing. Not seen that torque limiter triggered on other flashed cars so I'm sure its something specific to your flash.
That one timing drop you had in high gear? You'll recall at the time I think there is a problem with a torque limiter in your specific flash map there. If you were hitting a "boost cap" you'd have boost reduced not timing. Not seen that torque limiter triggered on other flashed cars so I'm sure its something specific to your flash.
were still around terry just too much work going on in the shop to mess with the stinger right now. we never really had any problem at all hooking the car up when it was running around 23-24psi but as soon as we started flirting with the higher boost levels it wasnt possible with the track prep we were dealing with during the hotter months here. Nobody really starts running fast until fall/winter when all the no prep and grudge racing starts when we can do a track rental with some really good prep. The car trapped 126-127 maybe 4 passes the same night but just blew the tires off so the times werent too great. We have run a bunch of times that would still hold the top spot but until the car is capable of hooking up and not freaking out to get into the 10's we really dont care. Hope all you guys out there racing are doing well and getting better results!
