FAQ: Vibration under braking: warped rotors? NO!

[Maljey]

As a breakdown of our pad range, below are some key points;

Ultimax - OEM replacement, low dust, eco-friendly non metallic pad. Easy on rotors.

Greenstuff - entry level upgrade from OEM, not track capable. Medium/Low dust. Eco-friendly material

Redstuff – Organic blend, lowest dust & kind on rotors, better friction than Green. For higher HP &/or heavier cars. Ceramic particle enhanced, NOT ceramic fibres. Long lasting, not track capable

Yellowstuff - Street performance, great friction for spirited driving, works good from cold, works best when hot. Takes longer to bed. Not low dust

Bluestuff - Hybrid Street & track pad. High friction street pad capable of track days. Works great from cold. Quicker bedding. Not low dust. 0.52mu coefficient & 0.42mu coefficient available for some rear applications (lighter cars)


RP1/X series – all-out track pad, high performance, RPX high 0.55mu torque for under servo'd cars RP1 medium 0.45mu torque for over servo'd cars. Not for street use.


for mostly street use with occasional fast driving and heavy braking, Yellowstuff or Redstuff would be my recommendation. All Kia Stinger products can be found at this link for purchase in USA

So if someone were to autocross their Stinger, would EBC Redstuff still be sufficient? I know it's not for track duty, but I think Autocross may fall into the 'spirited driving' (i.e. Yellowsuff) category?

Interested in hearing your (or other's) response.

 

[Volfy]

So if someone were to autocross their Stinger, would EBC Redstuff still be sufficient? I know it's not for track duty, but I think Autocross may fall into the 'spirited driving' (i.e. Yellowsuff) category?

Interested in hearing your (or other's) response.

With very few exceptions, most AutoX's are laid out such that most cars run the course in about a minute - or less. Each heat is typically 4-5, at most 6 run, separated by some 10-15min. Even if you double driver, you'd still have 5-8mins of cool down time between runs. With that sort of duration, even in the hottest Summer heat, your brakes are not going to get hot enough to need high-temp track pad compound. Even OEM pads would do fine, as I have done in a few AutoX events. Yes, I do mean the awful ones everybody hates, prone to leaving pad material deposits on the rotors.

So, if you attend AutoXs only very occasionally (just to have a bit of fun), Redstuff works just fine.

However, if you plan on going regularly and are serious about it as a sport, then upgrading to something that is more tilted toward performance might be a good idea. Yellowstuff is the ideal compromise for the frequent AutoXers. Higher friction coefficient will allow you to carry more speed into a corner, brake later, and trim your run time.

The only reason you should consider Bluestuff (or higher) is you ever plan on going to a track day, where each run could be 20-25min long - balls to the wall. Your brakes will get toasty. For that, EBC no longer recommends the Yellowstuff.

One of the biggest downside with higher performance (higher heat range) pad compounds is the volume of brake dust. So factor in how willing you are at putting up with that. You will have to clean the wheels more often with Yellowstuff - and especially with Bluestuff - than with OEM pads.

 

[Kazz]

With very few exceptions, most AutoX's are laid out such that most cars run the course in about a minute - or less. Each heat is typically 4-5, at most 6 run, separated by some 10-15min. Even if you double driver, you'd still have 5-8mins of cool down time between runs. With that sort of duration, even in the hottest Summer heat, your brakes are not going to get hot enough to need high-temp track pad compound. Even OEM pads would do fine, as I have done in a few AutoX events. Yes, I do mean the awful ones everybody hates, prone to leaving pad material deposits on the rotors.

So, if you attend AutoXs only very occasionally (just to have a bit of fun), Redstuff works just fine.

However, if you plan on going regularly and are serious about it as a sport, then upgrading to something that is more tilted toward performance might be a good idea. Yellowstuff is the ideal compromise for the frequent AutoXers. Higher friction coefficient will allow you to carry more speed into a corner, brake later, and trim your run time.

The only reason you should consider Bluestuff (or higher) is you ever plan on going to a track day, where each run could be 20-25min long - balls to the wall. Your brakes will get toasty. For that, EBC no longer recommends the Yellowstuff.

One of the biggest downside with higher performance (higher heat range) pad compounds is the volume of brake dust. So factor in how willing you are at putting up with that. You will have to clean the wheels more often with Yellowstuff - and especially with Bluestuff - than with OEM pads.

And don't forget to flush and replace the brake fluid with high quality product.

 

[Maljey]

With very few exceptions, most AutoX's are laid out such that most cars run the course in about a minute - or less. Each heat is typically 4-5, at most 6 run, separated by some 10-15min. Even if you double driver, you'd still have 5-8mins of cool down time between runs. With that sort of duration, even in the hottest Summer heat, your brakes are not going to get hot enough to need high-temp track pad compound. Even OEM pads would do fine, as I have done in a few AutoX events. Yes, I do mean the awful ones everybody hates, prone to leaving pad material deposits on the rotors.

So, if you attend AutoXs only very occasionally (just to have a bit of fun), Redstuff works just fine.

However, if you plan on going regularly and are serious about it as a sport, then upgrading to something that is more tilted toward performance might be a good idea. Yellowstuff is the ideal compromise for the frequent AutoXers. Higher friction coefficient will allow you to carry more speed into a corner, brake later, and trim your run time.

The only reason you should consider Bluestuff (or higher) is you ever plan on going to a track day, where each run could be 20-25min long - balls to the wall. Your brakes will get toasty. For that, EBC no longer recommends the Yellowstuff.

One of the biggest downside with higher performance (higher heat range) pad compounds is the volume of brake dust. So factor in how willing you are at putting up with that. You will have to clean the wheels more often with Yellowstuff - and especially with Bluestuff - than with OEM pads.

Excellent, thank you! I will probably be autocrossing the car very casually. Maybe once a month at most during spring and summer. I still have a loooooooonnnnggggg time to go before I will need to replace the stock pads. My car is still basically new. Just wanted to get some opinions on EBC since they seem to be highly recommended here.

 

[IrishBulls]

Any advice here..... Bought my 22 GT1 with 19k on it. Had the famous brake shake. Replaced front and rear pads in hopes that would fix the issue. Better bite than stock but still some shake/shudder at high speed braking. Am I okay to just replace the rotors now, or did I screw up the new pads by using them on the old OEM rotors? I've had someone tell me I now have to replace the pads as well even though they are hardly a week old.

Thanks for the help.

 

[Volfy]

Just wanted to get some opinions on EBC since they seem to be highly recommended here.

I'm probably guilty for a good bit of that impression. To be fair, I'm sure other mfrs' pads could work quite well too. I don't have any ties to EBC, other than the fact that I've always had good results with their sintered HH motorcycle pads. So, when I went looking for replacement pads for the Stinger, I naturally looked them up first.

That said, what really sold them for me is the comprehensive lines of pads they offer for just about every application you can think of. Very few brake pad mfrs bother to offer as many. A total of 6 or 7... I lost count. Neither do other mfrs always detail out specs and intended use for each compound, as well as the break-in and bed-in procedure(s) for each. EBC just makes it easy to pick the right pad compound for the job, so I know precisely what to expect.

They can, however, be on the expensive side.

 

[Snicklefritz]

Any advice here..... Bought my 22 GT1 with 19k on it. Had the famous brake shake. Replaced front and rear pads in hopes that would fix the issue. Better bite than stock but still some shake/shudder at high speed braking. Am I okay to just replace the rotors now, or did I screw up the new pads by using them on the old OEM rotors? I've had someone tell me I now have to replace the pads as well even though they are hardly a week old.

Thanks for the help.

not likely needing to replace the pads. if you can bed in the pads on new rotors that will positively answer the question. did you try resurfacing the oem rotors? it sounds like you brake hard from high speed and the shudder doesn't go away, so, bedding in on the rotors as-is won't do it. but others have had success with the oem rotors turned and brand new aftermarket pads. the oem rotors are good ones.

 

[IrishBulls]

not likely needing to replace the pads. if you can bed in the pads on new rotors that will positively answer the question. did you try resurfacing the oem rotors? it sounds like you brake hard from high speed and the shudder doesn't go away, so, bedding in on the rotors as-is won't do it. but others have had success with the oem rotors turned and brand new aftermarket pads. the oem rotors are good ones.

Yeah I didn't turn the rotors I just put the new pads on and that didn't clear it up. Probably should have had them turned but the car is only a year old so I thought just new pads might clear up the brake shake. So you don't think my new pads are screwed from running on the oem rotors?

 

[Snicklefritz]

So you don't think my new pads are screwed from running on the oem rotors?

unlikely in so short of time. brake lightly until you either turn the oems or get new rotors, do that very soon, then try braking 'normally' at first and if the braking feels smooth keep braking normally for a while. for instance, kia in the 'break in' period of 600 miles on a new car also says to use the brakes easily during that time; bedding in new pads is only for hard brake use, really; if you are going to do hard braking from high speeds, then follow the bedding in instructions that come with the pads.

 

[Volfy]

Any advice here..... Bought my 22 GT1 with 19k on it. Had the famous brake shake. Replaced front and rear pads in hopes that would fix the issue. Better bite than stock but still some shake/shudder at high speed braking. Am I okay to just replace the rotors now, or did I screw up the new pads by using them on the old OEM rotors? I've had someone tell me I now have to replace the pads as well even though they are hardly a week old.

Thanks for the help.

Sometimes you can get away with not resurfacing the rotors. If the rotors were in great condition, smooth, not scored... maybe. At the very least, you should micrometer the rotor wearing surface to make sure the thickness is mostly even from the inside to the outside. Otherwise, if there is a bevel or if there is unevenly wear, your new pads will have a hard time seating against the rotor. Besides, you needed to find out if the rotor thicknesses are well above the minimum allowable. Granted, 19k miles isn't a lot, but you don't know how those 19k miles were driven.

Regardless of whether you did turn the rotors or not, you shouldn't be doing any high speed braking right after changing to new pads. The first week should be for seating the new brake pads. That means driving - and braking - very gently. After every drive, take a very close look at all 4 rotors. You are looking to see if the new brake pads are making full contact with the entire rotor mating area. Resurfacing the rotors essentially "squares" the rotor surfaces, so they have the best chance of making even pressure contact with the "square" new brake pads. Even then, seating may still take 50-100 miles of easy driving - and gentle braking - to accomplish fully. If you didn't turn the rotors, seating might take longer... or it might not ever happen well enough for best performance.

Not knowing how the car was driven the first 19k mile before, the conditions your rotors when you changed the pads are unknown, and not knowing how you drove the car with the new pads, there is no way any of us can know for certain the best course of action for you. You can try getting the rotors resurfaced and try again with your current pads, but who knows... your rotors might already be heat spotted or heat checked.

 

[IrishBulls]

Sometimes you can get away with not resurfacing the rotors. If the rotors were in great condition, smooth, not scored... maybe. At the very least, you should micrometer the rotor wearing surface to make sure the thickness is mostly even from the inside to the outside. Otherwise, if there is a bevel or if there is unevenly wear, your new pads will have a hard time seating against the rotor. Besides, you needed to find out if the rotor thicknesses are well above the minimum allowable. Granted, 19k miles isn't a lot, but you don't know how those 19k miles were driven.

Regardless of whether you did turn the rotors or not, you shouldn't be doing any high speed braking right after changing to new pads. The first week should be for seating the new brake pads. That means driving - and braking - very gently. After every drive, take a very close look at all 4 rotors. You are looking to see if the new brake pads are making full contact with the entire rotor mating area. Resurfacing the rotors essentially "squares" the rotor surfaces, so they have the best chance of making even pressure contact with the "square" new brake pads. Even then, seating may still take 50-100 miles of easy driving - and gentle braking - to accomplish fully. If you didn't turn the rotors, seating might take longer... or it might not ever happen well enough for best performance.

Not knowing how the car was driven the first 19k mile before, the conditions your rotors when you changed the pads are unknown, and not knowing how you drove the car with the new pads, there is no way any of us can know for certain the best course of action for you. You can try getting the rotors resurfaced and try again with your current pads, but who knows... your rotors might already be heat spotted or heat checked.

Appreciate the response. I really haven't driven the car hard since replacing the pads, just highway driving. The brakes only shake when highway braking. So I think my options are get the rotors resurfaced (probably will just take them to the local auto parts store) and try the recently replaced brake pads. OR, just say screw it, cut my losses and buy a brand new set of pads again and this time just get new rotors. Here is a picture of the front right rotor before I changed the pad FWIW.

 

[Snicklefritz]

Here is a picture of the front right rotor before I changed the pad FWIW.

fwiw it looks cruddy. if there are cementite - heat spots - turning won't work anyway. but those look like pad deposits and if the rotor is within spec thickness a resurface should work.

 

[Volfy]

Appreciate the response. I really haven't driven the car hard since replacing the pads, just highway driving. The brakes only shake when highway braking. So I think my options are get the rotors resurfaced (probably will just take them to the local auto parts store) and try the recently replaced brake pads. OR, just say screw it, cut my losses and buy a brand new set of pads again and this time just get new rotors. Here is a picture of the front right rotor before I changed the pad FWIW.

That actually doesn't look too bad. In fact, they look far better than a lot of used Stingers I've seen. I don't see any signs of heat stress. It's not a close up enough for me to tell if the patterns are just leftover pad material deposit that hasn't been scrubbed off completely yet. That is entirely possible. See here and compare my pics with how yours look up close. FAQ: Vibration under braking: warped rotors? NO!

As I mentioned in the link above, I tried getting away with not resurfacing and ended up with problem on the front brakes. Resurfacing took care of that. Rears worked perfectly without turning the rotors. Right now, my rears rotors look as perfectly seated as the the front. You cannot tell the rears have not been resurfaced.

Your options:

1. Continue to drive as is - albeit as gently as traffic would allow - and see if the shuddering eventual goes away.

2. Remove the rotors and get them resurfaced. O'Reily's cut mine for $25 a corner. So at most $100 total.

3. Get brand new rotors. I prefer quality vented solid rotors. I got mine for about $220 total before the pandemic. Now it's probably more like $320+.


If you get the sense that the shuddering is reducing in intensity since you changed the pads, I'd be inclined to suggest you go Option #1. If not, maybe #2 is a safer bet.

 

[Volfy]

BTW, if you haven't done so when you changed the pads, get a few cans of brake cleaner and hose down each rotor (both sides) and the brake pads thoroughly. Any oily crud or greasy residue would also tend to cause shuddering at speed.

Brand new brake pads should be clean, but its always a good idea to clean them after install. New rotors are almost always marinated in oil. I hosed my brand new ones with a full tall can of brake cleaner each.

 

[IrishBulls]

That actually doesn't look too bad. In fact, they look far better than a lot of used Stingers I've seen. I don't see any signs of heat stress. It's not a close up enough for me to tell if the patterns are just leftover pad material deposit that hasn't been scrubbed off completely yet. That is entirely possible. See here and compare my pics with how yours look up close.

As I mentioned in the link above, I tried getting away with not resurfacing and ended up with problem on the front brakes. Resurfacing took care of that. Rears worked perfectly without turning the rotors. Right now, my rears rotors look as perfectly seated as the the front. You cannot tell the rears have not been resurfaced.

Your options:

1. Continue to drive as is - albeit as gently as traffic would allow - and see if the shuddering eventual goes away.

2. Remove the rotors and get them resurfaced. O'Reily's cut mine for $25 a corner. So at most $100 total.

3. Get brand new rotors. I prefer quality vented solid rotors. I got mine for about $220 total before the pandemic. Now it's probably more like $320+.


If you get the sense that the shuddering is reducing in intensity since you changed the pads, I'd be inclined to suggest you go Option #1. If not, maybe #2 is a safer bet.

Okay cool. I'll drive it for a few days and see if it gets any better. It's definitely better than before I changed the pads fwiw. Only shakes when braking over 65 mph. But I'll plan to get the rotors turned at O'Reily's probably next weekend if nothing changes. I just won't have time to get the car up on jacks until then. And then if that fails I'll just replace all the rotors and probably new pads....again....

Yeah my rotors looked a little better than the ones in your photos so maybe there's still hope that my new pads aren't screwed? And yep, I drenched them in brake cleaner when I changed the pads. Didn't think to spray the new pads though.

Again, appreciate the insight.

 

[Scorpion24]

Okay cool. I'll drive it for a few days and see if it gets any better. It's definitely better than before I changed the pads fwiw. Only shakes when braking over 65 mph. But I'll plan to get the rotors turned at O'Reily's probably next weekend if nothing changes. I just won't have time to get the car up on jacks until then. And then if that fails I'll just replace all the rotors and probably new pads....again....

Yeah my rotors looked a little better than the ones in your photos so maybe there's still hope that my new pads aren't screwed? And yep, I drenched them in brake cleaner when I changed the pads. Didn't think to spray the new pads though.

Again, appreciate the insight.

How you doing now?

I just got vibrations slowing down from (110ish) last night.
I’m on stock rotors and pads 14kmiles.

I’ll prob get new pads, but not sure if I should start looking at rotors as well.

Or try bedding on this stock set up and then get new pads.

 

[D.J.]

How you doing now?

I just got vibrations slowing down from (110ish) last night.
I’m on stock rotors and pads 14kmiles.

I’ll prob get new pads, but not sure if I should start looking at rotors as well.

Or try bedding on this stock set up and then get new pads.

Try bedding in new pads, with stock rotors....

Works for many.

 

[Cameron_417]

I got the power stop Z26 and dust is minimal, 0 vibration, great stopping power and I drive aggressive. I punch it between stop lights and heat up my breaks quick. No issues at all.

Full z26 rotors and pad set for front and rear? I just got my rear set delivered and ordering the fronts now...

 

[20Stinger19]

Just outta curiosity has anyone ever tried installing any of those $200 ebay brake rotors for our cars?

 

[seeyainakia]

I just installed the power stop Z26 front and back. I have a 2018 (was completely stock and original) I bought with extremely low mileage about 18 months ago and soon after got the brake shuddering issue. I followed the advice in this forum and did the "process" but after a few weeks the shudder always came back.
SO I did several hard stops from 60>5mph one more time to clean the rotors off and then swapped stock pads for the Z26 and followed Powerstop's bedding process. I'm still on stock untouched rotors.

Anyway, the Powerstop's have been awesome. What an improvement, feels great! Only thing is, after a couple weeks I'm starting to notice a very very small shudder- nothing like before, extremely minor, barely noticeable. But I notice it.

Any thoughts on best way to eliminate?