FAQ: Vibration under braking: warped rotors? NO!

[Zstinger]

I would get it repaired under warranty. If it's within 12k miles and/or 12 months you're golden. Kia might do a goodwill gesture though... I have seen it from other members on the forums... they know the problem is pretty common at this point!

1.5 years old would expect they’ll take care of it? Will keep you posted thanks for the reply hope this isn’t a continuing problem

 

[dtrail7a]

1.5 years old would expect they’ll take care of it? Will keep you posted thanks for the reply hope this isn’t a continuing problem

I took mine in at 11,500 last month. Kia covered the rotors (warped) as they like to say. ‍ They were literally going to put the same pads back in. Not just Kia pads. THE SAME PADS. Get after market pads. I went with stoptech.

 

[ChaneRZ]

Aftermarket pads and be done with it. I went with Stoptech too. Front/back.

 

[Stinger GT SS]

Found this Q&A about rotors from dba AU site, that may be of interest to some.

Disc Q&A

DISC Q & A

dba.com.au

 

[WRXtoStingerGT]

1.5 years old would expect they’ll take care of it? Will keep you posted thanks for the reply hope this isn’t a continuing problem

Depends on the dealership and how Corporate is feeling that day...

My brake problems started at 3000 miles and continued into 6000 miles. Took them five repairs over the course of six months. Pretty comical. (it did not cost me a thing though - besides my time of course)

As everyone else has suggested either have them replace everything with the European parts or go with aftermarket... my problems finally went away when they replaced the pads and rotors with Euro-spec parts.

Good luck and yes keep us posted!

P.S. - this is a very common problemo that almost every single Stinger with the factory Brembo setup will experience... some get it more than others and some have the problem recurring more often than others... good luck!

 

[Zstinger]

Depends on the dealership and how Corporate is feeling that day...

My brake problems started at 3000 miles and continued into 6000 miles. Took them five repairs over the course of six months. Pretty comical. (it did not cost me a thing though - besides my time of course)

As everyone else has suggested either have them replace everything with the European parts or go with aftermarket... my problems finally went away when they replaced the pads and rotors with Euro-spec parts.

Good luck and yes keep us posted!

P.S. - this is a very common problemo that almost every single Stinger with the factory Brembo setup will experience... some get it more than others and some have the problem recurring more often than others... good luck!

will certainly inquire as to the Euro Spec parts....thanks for the reply

 

[Zstinger]

will certainly inquire as to the Euro Spec parts....thanks for the reply

 

[WHITEGT]

Aftermarket pads and be done with it. I went with Stoptech too. Front/back.

which of the stoptech pads did you use? do you have a model #

thank you

 

[ChaneRZ]

Kia Stinger 3.3T - Stoptech Performance - Front & Rear Street Ceramic Brake Pads

Enhance your Kia Stinger braking system with the Stoptech Performance Brake Pads. These pads are carefully selected & tested for optimum results that offer better performance & longevity. These pads are made with Para-aramid composites which provide linear response regardless of pad temperature...

www.k8stingerstore.com

 

[WHITEGT]

STOPTECH told me that they don't make a STOPTECH pad for the Stinger only in the CENTRIC line up
these are EVO and Camaro pads

 

[dtrail7a]

STOPTECH told me that they don't make a STOPTECH pad for the Stinger only in the CENTRIC line up
these are EVO and Camaro pads

Well w.e. they are I know they work. I did the 2 sets of 10 bedding process with a cool down in between the 2 sets and my car stops on a dime. Never thought I'd brag about how well brakes work but I do. That was just with the front set installed.

 

[WHITEGT]

Stop tech Front Pads # 308.10010 these are the STREET pad , the SPORT pads are 309.10010 amazon has them for cheap

AMAZON CANADA $65

StopTech 308.10010 Street Brake Pads; Front, Rear with Shims, Brake Pads - Amazon Canada​

StopTech 308.10010 Street Brake Pads; Front, Rear with Shims in Brake Pads.
www.amazon.ca

AMAZON USA $45
https://www.amazon.com/StopTech-308-10010-Street-Brake-Pads/dp/B01DE4EYEG/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=308.10010&qid=1615779951&sr=8-1

 

[WRXtoStingerGT]

will certainly inquire as to the Euro Spec parts....thanks for the reply

For sure! Good luck!!

 

[ghost_of_john_lennon]

The following is an FAQ about why your Stinger is experiencing vibration under braking. I’ve seen a lot of talk on the Facebook groups about this issue, and a lot of misinformation, and I’ve gotten tired of typing the same thing over and over again, so here’s a comprehensive FAQ that I can link to in the future.

Q. I already know why it’s happening! The problem is due to warped rotors, because Kia cheaped out on the rotors!

A. First of all, that wasn’t a question, and second of all, you’re wrong. The rotors on the Stinger GT are built to Brembo spec. They are annealed at temperatures higher than your brakes will ever see, even on the track, and are 13.9” vented rotors, which results in great heat dissipation.

Q. But they’re not built to Brembo spec! They’re not drilled or slotted!

A. Still not a question, and still wrong. There are plenty of Brembo rotors that are solid (as opposed to cross-drilled or slotted). My Chevrolet SS (RIP) had solid (but vented) rotors of around the same size as the Stinger’s. Also, I never had any problems with them “warping.”

Q. Well, if warped rotors aren’t the problem, why is everyone getting the problem fixed by getting their rotors turned or replaced?

A. Because that actually does fix the problem, at least temporarily. And dealers don’t care because Kia pays them for the work, and Kia wants to make the owners of their first big-selling premium car happy. But that’s like declaring your car a total loss because you got a scrape on the bumper. Replacing the bumper is a much easier, cheaper, and simpler option. And likewise, there is an easier fix for the brake vibration too.

Q. Okay, so if the problem isn’t warped rotors, what is it?

A. Pad deposits.

Q. Wait, what are pad deposits?

A. When you brake hard repeatedly due to spirited driving, or apply the brakes for a sustained period of time as you might if you’re coming down a really big hill, your brakes heat up. Not just the rotors -- also the fluid, which can cause total brake failure in some cases, but more importantly, the pads. As the pads heat up, they soften. Once they are hot enough, large amounts of semi-liquid pad material start coming off and sticking to the rotors. This material stays on the rotors even after the brakes cool.

Q. So why does this cause brake vibration?

A. Because brake vibration is caused by rotor runout (different thicknesses of the rotors at different points around their circumference). This can be due to warping (which we’ve already established is unlikely to happen), due to rust on the rotors that accumulates while the car is sitting and that is scraped off unevenly once the car is driven again, or due to pad material being deposited unevenly around the circumference (thicker in some places, thinner in others).

Q. Why is it unevenly deposited, though?

A. The most common cause is that you heat the pads up, and then come to a stop at a light and keep the brake pedal depressed. It can also be caused by dragging your brakes at low speeds (e.g. inching forward at a light or in traffic). Please note that this scenario (heating up the brakes and then applying them at low speeds and/or keeping them applied) is the most likely reason this problem occurs.

Q. I still don’t believe that this is due to pad deposits and not warped rotors. Where’s your proof?

Take a look at this article by Carroll Smith, who was one of the lead engineers on the original Ford GT40 program for Le Mans and also worked with the Ferrari F1 team and teams in Formula 5000 and the Australian Touring Car Championship:

Here’s the money quote:


(Side note: that article corroborates a lot of the stuff I’m saying here, and goes into more technical detail, with more specific recommendations on how to prevent the problem. Good read!)

Q. Okay, okay, you’ve convinced me. You said there was another way to fix this. How is that?

A. You need to do a “re-bed” of the brakes. This removes the uneven pad deposits, and applies a new, even layer of pad material to allow the pads to properly grab the discs.

Q. Okay, how do you do that? I hope I’m not going to be under the car for 2 hours doing this.

A. Nah, you won’t be under the car at all.

• You need to get in your car and drive to some place where you can get up to 60-80 mph. (With as much power as the Stinger GT has, this shouldn’t be hard, unless you live at the top of a mountain.)
• You then need to brake, as hard as you can (that’s important!), from 60-80 mph to 5 mph, then immediately let off the brake without dragging, accelerate, and repeat.
• Do this 4-5 times.
• After you finish, DO NOT TOUCH THE BRAKES UNLESS YOU HAVE NO CHOICE. You can either drive around for 10-20 minutes without touching the brakes to give them time to cool, or immediately park the car, turn it off, and leave it alone for an hour or two. Either way, the goal is to leave the even layer of pad material intact, and not add any more, until the pads cool enough to prevent further transfer.

Q. Uh oh! I did this and then got to a stoplight that turned red! What do I dooooooooo

A. It’s okay. Not ideal, but okay. Gently brake to around 5 mph (use the paddles to shift to lower gears, so that the engine braking does most of the work), then apply the electronic parking brake (EPB (Electronic Parking Brake)). The car won’t like this (it will ding at you), but it will do as it’s told, as long as you’re slow enough. The parking brake uses shoes inside the rear disc, and these are made of steel and are not affected by the heat in the same way that the semi-metallic pads are. Once the light turns, apply the throttle and the EPB (Electronic Parking Brake) will turn off automatically.

Q. Wait, I read the manual and it talked about a “brake bedding” or “brake burnishing” process, and this sounds much more aggressive? Why? I’m not going to destroy the brakes, am I?

A. Keep in mind that you need to not just put the new even material layer down (which is what the initial bedding process does), but you also have to remove as much of the old uneven material as you can. This process does that too, hence why it’s so aggressive. You definitely will shorten the life of your pads by doing it, but that just means you can replace them with something less crappy sooner (more on that later).

Q. I did this and I’m still having problems. You’re wrong!

A. Again with the non-questions!

Do it again.

No, seriously. Either you did it wrong, or the deposits are so substantial that you need to do it again to fully remove them. We’ll be charitable and say it’s the latter reason. It’s theoretically possible that you’re one of the 1% of people who have this problem not due to pad deposits, but, well, read the article I linked to above to see why that’s probably not the case.

Q. I did this and it worked for a couple thousand miles, but now the vibration is back. I thought this was a permanent fix?

A. Unfortunately, no, it’s not a permanent fix, because Kia used a crappy pad compound that can’t stand up to aggressive braking. In fact, they only used this dumbed-down compound in the U.S. -- in Europe, they get stuff that’s more aggressive and doesn’t do this as easily.

Q. Ugh, Kia is the WORST! Why would they do that?

A. Actually, I don’t blame them. The problem with the more aggressive compound that they use elsewhere, and that many other manufacturers use on their cars equipped with Brembos, is it’s noisy and it’s dusty.

Q. Well why can’t they make a high performance compound that doesn’t have noise and dust?

A. Because it’s a tradeoff. If you want a compound that has better heat resistance and initial bite, it needs to be harder. If it’s harder, you get noise (because it doesn’t conform as well to the rotor, causing harmonic vibrations similar to the ones you cause when you wet your finger and run it around the rim of a wine glass) and dust (because instead of melting off, the material that comes off the pad when you brake hard just kind of flakes off or gets shaved off in very small pieces). If you use the softer compound, it’s going to melt much sooner. Kind of like butter! Brake pads made of butter really suck, BTW.

Q. Well, I’d be okay with more noise and dust. Why wouldn’t everyone?

A. Good question! I love noise and dust. On my old WRX, I had aftermarket pads that squealed at 100 dB every time I touched the brakes, and my wheels literally had rust on them from the pads wearing away at the rotors. But those brakes grabbed like a psycho ex-girlfriend. For most people, though, they don’t want to put up with that.

When I had my Chevy SS (once again, RIP), noise/squeal and dust were the number one complaint on the forums. And that was on a car that’s literally a 4-door Corvette. People buying a Kia with a really nice interior aren’t going to be even that receptive to noise and dust.

Q. Okay, but I said I’m okay with noise and dust. Can I get summa dat?

A. Actually, yes. According to Car and Driver, Kia will be selling the Euro-spec pads through their dealer parts departments. I’m not sure if they’re for sale yet, but when they are, that’s the permanent fix.

Q. What if I'm not okay with noise and dust?

A. Remember that the problem of uneven deposits is caused by either dragging the brakes at low speeds, or keeping the brakes applied at a stop, while they are heated up. The trick I described above, where you are careful after driving hard to apply the electronic parking brake at a stoplight instead of using the brake pedal, can at the very least reduce the risk of the issue happening.

Q. Kia keeps on replacing rotors under warranty on these cars. Can I get them to give me the pads under warranty instead?

A. Good question! I’m currently trying this tack. I’ve had vibration under braking three times in 8600 miles, and have fixed it through a re-bed each time, but I’d like a better solution. I’ll keep you posted on whether I have success.

Any other questions?

You can get the Euro pads from any Kia dealer for ~220-250, they are semi-organic, and they do not leave pad deposits like our terrible ceramic pads. That is what will solve your issue. I have bedded my car multiple times after the vibration has shown up, exactly as the TSB indicates, and stil no go. The Euro pads solved it.

 

[ghost_of_john_lennon]

Shaking under braking..... Got replacement rotors under warranty.... Problem solved.

How many miles? Man, you need the Euro pads, it will come back, guaranteed.

 

[WHITEGT]

You can get the Euro pads from any Kia dealer for ~220-250, they are semi-organic, and they do not leave pad deposits like our terrible ceramic pads. That is what will solve your issue. I have bedded my car multiple times after the vibration has shown up, exactly as the TSB indicates, and stil no go. The Euro pads solved it.

do you have the euro spec part #'s

 

[ghost_of_john_lennon]

do you have the euro spec part #'s

i do - H 58101 J5A55 - that's the fronts, it's a genesis number, but I am sure the Kia number is the same, the pads are the same as the brakes are exactly the same. I have not replaced the rears yet, but when you look them up or order them, the rear pad number is very close, and should be right there on front of the person in the interface. I have a 3.3t G70, but it is the exact same set and and issue. It's the pad compound. What we have determined on the G70 forums is that there are not currently any aftermarket pads that fit properly - they all include spacers, etc., and they are loose and rattley inside the calipers. I think the Hawks specifically. Additionally, none of the aftermarket pad makers have the balance weights like the stock pads, and that also leads to noises and rattles. So - so far - and I hope to be wrong about this soon - the only realistic option are the Euro pads from Kia/Hyundai via Brembo. They are 330.0 new, but online you can find them as cheap as 200.00 Mine were 220 from some genesis place in VA.

 

[ghost_of_john_lennon]

So good luck guys and gals, this is an incredibly irritating issue that is not a 'problem' per se, eg it on't kill you or cause the brakes to underperform or fail, it's just incredibly annoying, and Kia/Hyundai need to get those pads out of there. It's a dusting issue, is why we don't have the sem-organic Euro pads. Kia/Genesis focus groups showed - like all luxury makers - that buyers HATE washing their wheels, and having brake dust. So these are the solutions. It's a cure that is worse than the illness.

 

[D.J.]

I'm on my 4th complete set of rotors - soon to be 5th.

60,000kms on rotors here in Canada. I have 47,000 kms on my stinger. - will schedule another dealer visit shortly to complain again (they have never actually fixed the issue, they just replace rotors and say - vehicle has been returned to normal operation.

then, shortly thereafter - pulsations..

Still on my original pads - I expect my next dealer visit will be - new rotors again Kia North America doesn't seem to have a solution.




ALSO - and this is merely my opinion.
Possibly, Kia North america doesn't have a solution cause they do not know of a problem. They are being consistently lied to by the dealers.
Saw this first hand.
Dealer thinks they are doing me a favour by writing down - Felt vibration, measured runout, runout out of spec - replaced rotors.
As if this guarantees Kia Canada will honour the warranty (seems to work)

BUT NO RUNOUT MEASUREMENTS re being taken (confirmed) - just numbers on a report to get warranty approved.
I feel as if I should measure the runout myself before my next visit
The limit for runout is just 1.57 thou. (I do not know if this is inline with industry standards)


View attachment 48425

Well - today - at 59,706kms (almost at the end of my brake warranty) - had my 4th full set of replacement disks installed for free - again... and this will be the final free set - Now it's REALLY time for me to install aftermarket pads.

Not even a debate or argument - I reported brake pulsations, yet again - they confirmed
They claim to have measured run out as 0.0015" front and 0.0030" rear (maybe they did measure this time - can not confirm).
Service advisor notified me my pads are low (less than 3mm all around) and tried to sell me replacement OEM pads - to which I pleasantly declined.
4 new rotors approved without any hassle whatsoever - other than having to bring my car to them.

My car's brake rotor history:
1. car came with rotors (OEM) - new car
2. first replacement at 10,320kms - all 4 rotors replaced (warranty approved)
3. second replacement at 23,774kms - all 4 rotors replaced (warranty approved)
4. third replacement at 39,905kms - all 4 rotors replaced (warranty approved)
5. fourth replacement at 59,706kms - all 4 rotors replaced (warranty approved)

 

[WHITEGT]

i do - H 58101 J5A55 58101 J5A55 - that's the fronts, it's a genesis number, but I am sure the Kia number is the same, the pads are the same as the brakes are exactly the same. I have not replaced the rears yet, but when you look them up or order them, the rear pad number is very close, and should be right there on front of the person in the interface. I have a 3.3t G70, but it is the exact same set and and issue. It's the pad compound. What we have determined on the G70 forums is that there are not currently any aftermarket pads that fit properly - they all include spacers, etc., and they are loose and rattley inside the calipers. I think the Hawks specifically. Additionally, none of the aftermarket pad makers have the balance weights like the stock pads, and that also leads to noises and rattles. So - so far - and I hope to be wrong about this soon - the only realistic option are the Euro pads from Kia/Hyundai via Brembo. They are 330.0 new, but online you can find them as cheap as 200.00 Mine were 220 from some genesis place in VA.

are you saying 58101 J5A55 will fit the stinger 3.3 and solve the issue?