3.3TT How are Stinger owners cleaning their valves on their GDI engines?

[SteveCo]

That's a dealer created service schedule. It isn't what "Kia" recommends. Dealers create those to generate revenue and get customers to buy maintenance "packages" which bundle things that aren't required.

Pretty much everything they list under the scheduled service 1-4 are items listed in the owner's manual maintenance section. No, they're not going to refuse a failed transmission claim if you didn't lubricate your door seals yearly - but they would if you didn't check for oil leaks and fluid level at the prescribed intervals, and your transmission burned up because you let it run low.

Can you do the prescribed checks, services, and the important oil and filter changes yourself? Certainly, and a lot of us do. I keep very good records and receipts for that, just in case.

The stuff listed at the right of the page (including the fuel induction service) are not 'required' items, and are merely listed as available 'additional services' the dealer can provide. However some of it (like transmission and differential oil replacement) still falls within the KIA warranty period, when using the severe usage criteria. I'm amazed at the lengthy coolant change interval, and the fact that they never recommend changing the brake fluid at all!

With a PCV catch can there should be no need to introduce a Sea Foam cleaner. They don't clean everything anyway so why not just wait until it feels sluggish and then get it wallnut blasted? Chances are you may never even need to do it before you sell the car.

That's a personal call, whether you feel it's of benefit or not. Myself, for a few minutes of time and few dollars for a can of Seafoam (which I've used on pre-FI car and motorcycle engines in the past with positive results) it's worth it. Cheap, preventative maintenance that I'll do as part of my Spring once-over.

 

[terrelltechsup]

If you dont know how a direct injection motor works look it up. Fuel additives and detergents in the fuel do nothing pre cylinder in direct injected motors. Being informed can save you a ton at the dealership. You are taking the right steps in that direction. Some of us have been around the KDM scene for a long time and know the dealership BS. Dont expect Mercedes/BMW level recommendations from the Kia service department.

 

[SteveCo]

f you dont know how a direct injection motor works look it up.

Not sure who you're addressing here - I believe those who have posted so far are aware of how GDI works ...

 

[SKStinger]

Pretty much everything they list under the scheduled service 1-4 are items listed in the owner's manual maintenance section. No, they're not going to refuse a failed transmission claim if you didn't lubricate your door seals yearly - but they would if you didn't check for oil leaks and fluid level at the prescribed intervals, and your transmission burned up because you let it run low.

Can you do the prescribed checks, services, and the important oil and filter changes yourself? Certainly, and a lot of us do. I keep very good records and receipts for that, just in case.

The stuff listed at the right of the page (including the fuel induction service) are not 'required' items, and are merely listed as available 'additional services' the dealer can provide. However some of it (like transmission and differential oil replacement) still falls within the KIA warranty period, when using the severe usage criteria. I'm amazed at the lengthy coolant change interval, and the fact that they never recommend changing the brake fluid at all!

That's a personal call, whether you feel it's of benefit or not. Myself, for a few minutes of time and few dollars for a can of Seafoam (which I've used on pre-FI car and motorcycle engines in the past with positive results) it's worth it. Cheap, preventative maintenance that I'll do as part of my Spring once-over.

It’s not the items listed on that schedule that are concerning but the intervals. The coolant does not need to be changed at 48,000 Kms as “Service 4” has it listed for an absurd cost of $600. The owners manual has it at 200,000kms. Do you have a sheet that is unique to the Stinger with intervals that jive with the owners manual?

It’s for sure personal preference. Mine is to not pay the Dealer to perform maintenance that is not required or to do my own maintenance that is not necessary. With a PCV catch can, that optional fuel system maintenance won’t be needed for most people while they own the car. If @Angel wants to do so than for sure it’s his choice but I think he’s be better served by taking that money and investing in a WMI kit.

 

[terrelltechsup]

Not sure who you're addressing here - I believe those who have posted so far are aware of how GDI works ...

Anyone reading this thread that was sold the same bs from the dealer. Yes, carbon deposits on the intake valves is a problem on DI motors regardless or manufacturer because the fuel detergents dont touch the top side of the valves and therefore do not have a chance to clean the oil deposits due to the PCV system. Prevent the oil from entering your intake track and you by and large prevent carbon deposits from forming on the top side of your intake valves hence the importance of an oil catch can. WMI also cleans the intake downstream from the port it is injected from. If you take the necessary precautions you should not need to clean your intake valves period which is what this entire thread is about.

 

[SteveCo]

It’s not the items listed on that schedule that are concerning but the intervals. The coolant does not need to be changed at 48,000 Kms as “Service 4” has it listed for an absurd cost of $600. The owners manual has it at 200,000kms. Do you have a sheet that is unique to the Stinger with intervals that jive with the owners manual?

The sheet I have is the same one that I linked to online, and as I've seen it used elsewhere with dealer info overlaid, I expect its part of sales and marketing material supplied to them by Kia Canada.

When I picked up the car, I both toured and met with the head of the service department. I asked them about service costs, and used the 'Recommended Service' sheet to note the prices they wanted for doing the 'scheduled services' - as it was a generic sheet, the Stinger prices were higher than their base figures. I also got a price and description of what was involved for the 'major induction service', as that one caught my eye. It was described to me much as it was to @Kazz - purely a 'run through' cleaning process, with no exposure and mechanical/abrasive cleaning of the valves (e.g. walnut husk blasting).

While I will continue to perform and/or arrange for my own maintenance, I expect a lot of people won't question the cost or services suggested to them, won't bother to consult the car specific schedule in their owner's manual, and simply pay up for things like the early coolant replacement. The services are additive, but considering there is little else of note in Service 4 beside visual inspections, that's got to be some expensive antifreeze!

I do believe that periodic application of Seafoam (or CDC, etc.) intake treatment will help in keeping carbon deposits under control, as I don't think an OCC is a complete solution to the problem. I won't be paying the dealer to do it, but I believe it's well worth the minimal time and cost for DIY.

 

[DaBears4Lyfe]

Angel, you have the intake side only right? My intake side catches very little the pcv side I have to empty every couple weeks.

 

[Angel]

Angel, you have the intake side only right? My intake side catches very little the pcv side I have to empty every couple weeks.

I have both sides. They were both pretty much empty lol. Which is weird I seen others get a lot of oil in them. Especially the one o the breather side.

 

[terrelltechsup]

Angel, you have the intake side only right? My intake side catches very little the pcv side I have to empty every couple weeks.

I vented my breather side to atmosphere. Most people with two note that the breather side generates very little to no oil due to blow by. This is primarily due to the fact that it only comes into play when the PCV closes when you are under high boost situations. 98% of the time the PCV is open.

 

[MerlintheMad]

Interesting. I've been comparing the linked maintenance page http://kiavancouver.dldserver3.com/...b88e3f1572b95a238f7165f3686e7x_1426186306.jpg with the owner's manual. And remembering what my service tech said last time (at c. 14,440 miles): he said that at 15K miles the services start where I will have to start paying for certain items (I received 9 free oil changes, and I've used four so far).

Why would he say "15K miles"? That is smack between 12K and 18K by the manual: or multiples of 3K miles in "Severe Usage Conditions". 15K is the fifth multiple of 3K miles. But when I started maintenance, the first one was at c. 4K miles; and that was what my car's maintenance interval was set at. Then between the second and third maintenance, they changed the interval to every 3K miles. I had already asked months before why they had my car's interval set to 4K, when the manual said every 6K miles for an oil change. And I was told it is because Utah is considered a "severe" climate, because of the salt on our roads. Okay, I'm down with that. But that didn't explain why 4K was set at first. Hmm. I'm guessing it's because most of our year is salt free, so not quite as bad as "severe."

I'm heading to Texas in a couple of weeks. My oil change interval is set to every 4K miles again, so my 18,440 will just have passed when I get back. But before then, before I go, probably this week, I'll go in and have that "15K miles service" done, sans oil change. I wonder what it is that they'll charge me for? Is it the stuff in a "service 2"? I already got the free oil change part done a couple thousand miles ago; so the "$209.95" would be reduced by $49.95 for the 12K (in my case 15K) miles "service 2".

Anybody have any "further light and knowledge" to share on all of that?

 

[Angel]

I vented my breather side to atmosphere. Most people with two note that the breather side generates very little to no oil due to blow by. This is primarily due to the fact that it only comes into play when the PCV closes when you are under high boost situations. 98% of the time the PCV is open.

I have the pvc side occ routed back to the intake instead of the breather. Tork never send my filter or cap and they never will either lol.

 

[SteveCo]

Anybody have any "further light and knowledge" to share on all of that?

For one, it's a Canadian document - so the the '209.95' (and other 'starts at' pricing) is in Canadian funds, and the 'mileage' is kilometers.

Ask your dealer for a detailed list of the service interval rotation, and what each service entails - I'm sure they have something similar they can provide.

 

[terrelltechsup]

I have the pvc side occ routed back to the intake instead of the breather. Tork never send my filter or cap and they never will either lol.

You can get a filter at autozone. You can use those rubber floor caps for chairs to plug the intake port.

 

[MerlintheMad]

For one, it's a Canadian document - so the the '209.95' (and other 'starts at' pricing) is in Canadian funds, and the 'mileage' is kilometers.

Ask your dealer for a detailed list of the service interval rotation, and what each service entails - I'm sure they have something similar they can provide.

Yeah, I noticed that, after I printed it out. I've searched online, even at "my" dealer's website, and nothing as well laid out as the Canadian schedule is available. The only things showing for 15K miles are the same as a "Service 1", i.e. an oil change basically. So, I am still wondering what these added costs I was warned about are supposed to be.

 

[Angel]

You can get a filter at autozone. You can use those rubber floor caps for chairs to plug the intake port.

Do you think is better to run the filter and cap the intake ?

 

[SteveCo]

I found a few U.S. dealer sites link to this 'build your own' maintenance planner. You tell them your KIA model, mileage, trim level, normal or severe driving, etc. and it generates what services you have coming up, and what they comprise. The 'Grid' looks especially useful, and at first glance it seems to be pretty much in line with the OM maintenance schedule.

Might be handy as a planning tool ...

Kia Maintenance Schedule | Pat Peck Kia

 

[Sime]

So, Catch cans, if they are vital, why aren’t Kia designing them into the motor?

 

[Angel]

So, Catch cans, if they are vital, why aren’t Kia designing them into the motor?

There can be numerous reasons. Cost reduction, and one less thing owners have to change. Maybe Kia feels like there not necessary.

As long as you get your valves clean there should be no issue even without oil catch cans.

What I am really looking for is someone that has done a DIY on cleaning the valves?

 

[Angel]

Has anyone done a DIY of cleaning your valves?

Everyone has gotten very technical and yet to share if they have cleaned the valves themselves or taken to the dealer for it ?

 

[PMB]

I need to find it again. But I read a thing, or perhaps it was a video stating that Kia (and many others on modern DI engines) have made some adjustments to the valve timing to reduce issues with carbon buildup. During certain operating conditions, the intake valves to stay open for the first part of the compression stroke, with possibly an early FI event, and this causes unburnt fuel to wash back into the intake tract. This is essentially Atkinson cycle and would be used during eco mode?

Anyway, I honestly can't find any references that this engine can switch to Atkinson cycle which would allow this operation to happen and would mean that every time the car goes into Eco you'd be washing your intake valves.