Discussion of Stinger paint quality (Was - Paint Chip Issue)

[somedudedontknowwhoheis]

Instructions were on the bulletin for Yellow Stingers, question would be if this prep process existed for all colors? I guess only Kia can answer that question....

Yea, nothing you said seems to indicate just Yellow. Some time ago someone posted that they were told it was the oil (if I recall correctly) in the Yellow paint that was causing problems, but now you have information that says it was something under the paint.

Not that I'm holding my breath for any movement on non-Yellow at this point.

 

[AV8R]

Just got back from the auto body shop doing the respray on my Stinger in Sept, turns out he and his wife know my wife through an old neighbor, so I feel much better as he has been in business for over 30 years and was recommended as the best in my area. We are going to stay in contact during the process.

I asked him a bunch of questions we all have asked on this board and got educated answers from an expert in the field:

1. As I mentioned in an earlier post, the issue was with the prep of the metal surfaces. The reason Kia is not repainting the plastic is because the prep and paint process for plastic is different, there was no issue with that process. All plastic comes off the car and set aside during respray of the metal parts.

2. I asked if there would be an issue with color mismatch, he said even if he sprayed the plastics, it would never perfectly match because of the different materials (metal vs plastic) then showed me the mismatches in the sun already on my stock factory paint job.

3. Reason for not painting door jams is because they rarely see sun. He said the real issue is that exposure to the sun's UV causes a reaction in the paint and undercoating, because they didn't prep the undercoating correctly, the sun then causes the reaction that is causing the problem. Door jams won't see the sun much therefore we probably won't see the problem in that area which is why they aren't repainting that area.

4. As for how to blend edges without noticing, bumpers come off for respray, he said windows come out as well and then the open area gets masked from the interior. As for door jams, there is a stick on foam that goes on the door jam edge where the door closes to provide the match line and overspray from getting in. He said this product provides an invisible blend line and works well.

I took pix of the entire bulletin Kia sent him if anyone is interested. I can post it here but it's 9 pages. Basically it is as described above. Kia does not want to go down to the metal, he said they will if he has to but the issue was with whatever they rubbed on the undercoating prior to paint, they thought it was dry and ok to use but it was not and didn't allow the paint to stick properly. Cleaning up and re-prep of the undercoating before respray will fix the issue.

I hope this answers some of the questions posted. If there are anymore, let me know and I'll ask him.

Thank you for this detailed information. It will help others in the same situation elay their fears and answer their questions!

 

[MerlintheMad]

Some time ago someone posted that they were told it was the oil (if I recall correctly) in the Yellow paint that was causing problems, but now you have information that says it was something under the paint.

Before the "oil in the yellow paint" rumor, the very first theory being passed around was that Kia said it was a primer/undercoat problem with the Yellow. They have never even hinted at a problem with all the other colors.

 

[MattRain]

Well, here is some PAIN IN THE ASS bad news....

Re-Painted Micro Blue Stinger...

GOOD LUCK getting a clear bra installed on a newly repainted stinger here in Arizona... at least.

3 Weeks ago, I get in contact with a highly review, high end quality installer here in Arizona to get a clearbra installed on my newly repainted Stinger. I mention nothing about the car being repainted at this time, as I wouldn't think that that's important at all. Now fast forward to today. I go to drop the car off, and we get to taking about the car, as its the first one he has seen, or going to do any work on... and the issue about a re-paint comes up. (Me not thinking this would lead me down this rabbit hole of S**t.) Well, here's where everything hits the fan. He doesn't want to do an clearbra install on a car that is so freshly painted (3 Weeks old), unless a condition is met, which is totally fare. (Mine you I've already had him purchase all of the material for this job, with the first deposit that I've given him, so im kinda up shiz creek)
Conditions:
1) Wait a few more weeks, 1.5-2 months for the clear coat to be completely cure. With it being so hot here in AZ, we did a small fingernail pressure test, you can indent the clear coat...
or
2) Get something in writing from KMA, dealership, or paint shop stating that the paint is fine, and ready for a clearbra install.

For number 2... After a joint call with the paint shop and dealership, they will ONLY give me a VERBAL statement that the paint is ready for an install, and that they WONT say anything in writing.

If it wasn't interesting enough, I called some other shops with the same question. "I had my car repainted a few weeks ago, and looking to installed a clearbra on it. Would you do the install on a newly repainted car?" To my surprise.... everyone's answer was in the ball park of "NO", or "Only if there is something in writing that we wouldn't be held liable."

At this point, I have contacted KMA on this issue, and my Case advisor said she needs to do some research in regards to what KMA can do...

Now I get to do two trips back to back next week on the road with no protection.... GOING RAW... wish me luck??

 

[Keith Ruff]

Good luck! I will say I heard the same thing from my clearbra installer, wait a few months for paint to harden (or something like that) before installing the paint protection. I'll ask my auto body shop when I see him again but pretty sure that is kind of a standard answer.

 

[SilverNitr8]

Yeah, I wouldn't suggest getting a clear bra on until the clearcoat fully cured or you'll have more issue to deal with. I say rent a car or borrow from someone and drive your car as little as possible. The shop I always go to and they work on Lamborghini and Ferrari advised the same thing to me for my car (not a stinger)

 

[MattRain]

Paint Shop kept suggesting that I get one installed from them when I was having it repainted, but they wanted a ridiculous amount for a partial, hence why I decided to go with a different company... question is, if I need to wait so long (risking rogue Arizona flying debris (Daily issue)), then when would they have done their install??

 

[MerlintheMad]

Now I get to do two trips back to back next week on the road with no protection.... GOING RAW... wish me luck??

How bad can it be? Okay, it can be really bad. But what are the chances? Especially with you watching out like mad? If you get a nick or two, the shop can touch those up prior to the bra. A touch up doesn't need to dry like an entire paint job: it's just a tiny point of contact.

(Oh, and what @SilverNitr8 said!)

 

[Tonkabob]

Well, here is some PAIN IN THE ASS bad news....

Re-Painted Micro Blue Stinger...

GOOD LUCK getting a clear bra installed on a newly repainted stinger here in Arizona... at least.

3 Weeks ago, I get in contact with a highly review, high end quality installer here in Arizona to get a clearbra installed on my newly repainted Stinger. I mention nothing about the car being repainted at this time, as I wouldn't think that that's important at all. Now fast forward to today. I go to drop the car off, and we get to taking about the car, as its the first one he has seen, or going to do any work on... and the issue about a re-paint comes up. (Me not thinking this would lead me down this rabbit hole of S**t.) Well, here's where everything hits the fan. He doesn't want to do an clearbra install on a car that is so freshly painted (3 Weeks old), unless a condition is met, which is totally fare. (Mine you I've already had him purchase all of the material for this job, with the first deposit that I've given him, so im kinda up shiz creek)
Conditions:
1) Wait a few more weeks, 1.5-2 months for the clear coat to be completely cure. With it being so hot here in AZ, we did a small fingernail pressure test, you can indent the clear coat...
or
2) Get something in writing from KMA (Kia Motors America), dealership, or paint shop stating that the paint is fine, and ready for a clearbra install.

For number 2... After a joint call with the paint shop and dealership, they will ONLY give me a VERBAL statement that the paint is ready for an install, and that they WONT say anything in writing.

If it wasn't interesting enough, I called some other shops with the same question. "I had my car repainted a few weeks ago, and looking to installed a clearbra on it. Would you do the install on a newly repainted car?" To my surprise.... everyone's answer was in the ball park of "NO", or "Only if there is something in writing that we wouldn't be held liable."

At this point, I have contacted KMA (Kia Motors America) on this issue, and my Case advisor said she needs to do some research in regards to what KMA (Kia Motors America) can do...

Now I get to do two trips back to back next week on the road with no protection.... GOING RAW... wish me luck??

But now you no longer have Kia paint so it should be safe to drive for a month or two!

 

[eflyguy]

There's nothing a paint shop can do, only manufacturers have the ovens to bake the new paint so that it is fully gassed out. This isn't new information or a problem with any one paint shop.

Thanks again for the detailed info, Keith. My guess is that the "wrong prep" affects all cars painted during that time, but that different colors protect from the UV in different ways, yellow being the worst but probably blue the next to worst...

 

[Tonkabob]

There's nothing a paint shop can do, only manufacturers have the ovens to bake the new paint so that it is fully gassed out. This isn't new information or a problem with any one paint shop.

Thanks again for the detailed info, Keith. My guess is that the "wrong prep" affects all cars painted during that time, but that different colors protect from the UV in different ways, yellow being the worst but probably blue the next to worst...

I dont think my excessive blue chipping is UV related. My car is garaged day and night plus i live in Seattle. It's hardly been in the sun. If it is UV we are in big trouble a couple years down the road.

 

[A Member Who Left]

Yea, nothing you said seems to indicate just Yellow. Some time ago someone posted that they were told it was the oil (if I recall correctly) in the Yellow paint that was causing problems, but now you have information that says it was something under the paint.

Not that I'm holding my breath for any movement on non-Yellow at this point.

That comment about oil residue in the paint came from a Kia representative, not just Joe Public. Now they say that it is UV related and the paint and primer or something between the paint and primer breaks down with UV exposure. Does anyone on this forum actually believe that a completely different prep process was used JUST for the color yellow? Here is what a paint shop said about the REAL cause.......

“Reason for not painting door jams is because they rarely see sun. He said the real issue is that exposure to the sun's UV causes a reaction in the paint and undercoating, because they didn't prep the undercoating correctly, the sun then causes the reaction that is causing the problem. Door jams won't see the sun much therefore we probably won't see the problem in that area which is why they aren't repainting that area.” Quoted from another post here.

It seems pretty obvious to me that Kia is attempting a coverup here......no pun intended. Can the color influence the outcome? You betcha. Did they use a different prep process JUST for the yellow undercoating? Extremely doubtful. Are those with blue, red, black, etc. getting screwed? Seems pretty obvious to me and that this can only be brought to a logical conclusion via a legal process.

This is not an emotional post. I’m just trying to inject some common sense and logic based on what Kia themselves have said and what a paint shop said he was told by Kia. It is NOT just yellow.

 

[eflyguy]

I dont think my excessive blue chipping is UV related. My car is garaged day and night plus i live in Seattle. It's hardly been in the sun. If it is UV we are in big trouble a couple years down the road.

Clouds don't reduce UV as much as people think, and it covers a wide spectrum of different wavelengths.

Garages are pretty effective!

 

[MerlintheMad]

This is not an emotional post. I’m just trying to inject some common sense and logic based on what Kia themselves have said and what a paint shop said he was told by Kia. It is NOT just yellow.

Suggesting a class action lawsuit is emotional right off the bat. To suggest that there is only common sense here is disingenuous. Kia will respond positively if approached positively. The first antagonistic salvo will result in Kia's people circling the wagons. Then try and get anywhere with this!

Reds, Blacks, Blues, and any even more rare failures, will get to move forward and obtain spiff repaints on a case by case basis; not from some class action lawsuit! That's not even practical. It would play out over years. Nobody would be getting over it.

Now, if you can get a group together who accuse Kia of not honoring their paint warranty, that would be a different approach. But I will guess that the number of angry owners who actually have a legitimate beef against Kia not honoring their paint warranty will be extremely small, not enough for a class action in fact.

 

[Tonkabob]

Clouds don't reduce UV as much as people think, and it covers a wide spectrum of different wavelengths.

Garages are pretty effective!

We have had 3 months straight sun here in Seattle anyways but still garaged almost all the time. ☺

 

[Tonkabob]

Now, if you can get a group together who accuse Kia of not honoring their paint warranty, that would be a different approach. But I will guess that the number of angry owners who actually have a legitimate beef against Kia not honoring their paint warranty will be extremely small, not enough for a class action in fact.

If we get a group of owners together to claim KIA isn't honoring their warranty that would be a class action lawsuit. Unless we just want to write a stern letter together to feel better and expect no results.

 

[eljay]

Suggesting a class action lawsuit is emotional right off the bat. . . . Reds, Blacks, Blues, and any even more rare failures, will get to move forward and obtain spiff repaints on a case by case basis; not from some class action lawsuit! That's not even practical. It would play out over years. Nobody would be getting over it.

Maybe I'm speaking out of turn, since my current paint issue is unrelated to the flaking paint and only involves one tiny chip on the roof ditch moulding. But I have to agree with Merlin, mad though he may be.

Class action lawsuits, depending on the complexity, take a year or more. And what do you end up with at the end? Probably not an award equal to the price of a repaint, which you might receive long after you would have traded in your Stinger. And since Kia appears to be making a good faith attempt to correct the problem, a reputable law firm probably wouldn't take on a class action suit at this point, but would advise you to wait and only take legal action once Kia had shown an inability or unwillingness to adequately deal with the problem.

Let's save the big guns for issues involving threat to life or health.

 

[Tonkabob]

Maybe I'm speaking out of turn, since my current paint issue is unrelated to the flaking paint and only involves one tiny chip on the roof ditch moulding. But I have to agree with Merlin, mad though he may be.

Class action lawsuits, depending on the complexity, take a year or more. And what do you end up with at the end? Probably not an award equal to the price of a repaint, which you might receive long after you would have traded in your Stinger. And since Kia appears to be making a good faith attempt to correct the problem, a reputable law firm probably wouldn't take on a class action suit at this point, but would advise you to wait and only take legal action once Kia had shown an inability or unwillingness to adequately deal with the problem.

Let's save the big guns for issues involving threat to life or health.

Agree class action us off the table for yellow. Can't argue against a full buy back or replacement. But if the non yellow claim denials continue to grow it seems like the only option.

 

[somedudedontknowwhoheis]

Before the "oil in the yellow paint" rumor, the very first theory being passed around was that Kia said it was a primer/undercoat problem with the Yellow. They have never even hinted at a problem with all the other colors.

How was that a rumor? Is that not what those with Yellow in Australia were told? Them not saying anything about other colors isn't proof that there isn't a problem, so I'm not sure how your statement applies to anything. "They have never even hinted at a problem with all the other colors." so the short lived stop-sale on Blue doesn't apply either right? I guess we'll never know, because Kia never officially said so.

Many of your arguments in this thread have sounded like an appeal to authority (Your logical fallacy is appeal to authority)

Just because Kia has said Yellow is the only one with a problem doesn't make it true, just like them not saying anything publicly about the other colors doesn't mean they don't have a problem. Our own evidence seems to contradict that (evidence you often seem so quick to belittle by stating how small of a number it represents, even though I've said in pages back that Kia going public with anything skews the results, Yellow nearly had the same number as Blue and Black, then we started seeing that number go up as new members joined saying they had received the letter)

My original statement was simply pointing out that the bulletin that was obtained contained nothing specific to Yellow, which seemed to contradict other things members here have been told. Look, I'm not trying to start some rallying cry for a class action lawsuit, as I said in pages past, if cars of other colors are experiencing the same problem, they should be given the same options. We have seen several examples in this thread of how bad some cars are, many of them are worse than most Yellow.

Having just learned that a clear bra cannot be applied after the repaint for some time, thats all the more reason I want a swap/buyback now (including all the other issues I've mentioned in my other posts), but because my car isn't Yellow, that isn't an option for me. I live in a relatively rural area and it takes me hours to get to any of these places I'd have to go. The amount of time/energy I've wasted on this is already something I'll never be "compensated" for. So to have you continue to also say that other colors will be handled on a case by case basis with a "spiffy repaint" is a bit of a slap in the face and I'm tired of reading it. If your car doesn't have a problem, then I'm happy for you, but you seem to be fanning the flames without actually contributing anything, then you call people out when they get emotional or try to provide a counter argument. Was your trip to the dealership to prove @forzanerazzurri or anyone else wrong really necessary?

 

[AV8R]

So let me get this straight. You are saying that the more I leave my car in the sun, the greater the chance it will chip regardless of colour?