Cpi vs Wmi

[MikeG918]

So I have access to both e85 and meth, e85 is 1 mile away and meth is 2 miles away from me. I had a dual nozzle meth setup on another car so I’m very familiar with it. However having to keep up with everything that goes along with meth injection gets kind of old. With that said I have a few questions about cpi.

1.Is there any drop of the IAT’s?
2.Has anyone had any major issues?
3.Assuming nozzle maintenance is close to nothing?
4.Is there enough volume to wash the valves? (This was an added benifit on my old car)

My mods so far are bms 450 kit, fuel-it sensor, mbrp exhaust, hks plugs to replace the densos when they go and ark secondaries that I’m on the fence about installing as I’d like to keep the sound of the exhaust not obnoxious.

 

[Stiletto]

If you haven't read this, it is a good write up.

CPI vs WMI

Personally, I got tired of blending corn fuel with dead dinosaurs on my last car. I'll wait until the fueling issue is resolved on the Stinger and go full send on ethanol. For now, my WMI is good.

Oh, and the Ark secondaries on factory cat back isn't loud at all. It has a nice tone, a slight bit louder than the factory pipes (to be expected).

 

[MikeG918]

Ah perfect man, I tried googling but couldn’t find much thanks for the link. As for my concern with the secondaries, I have an mbrp catback and to be honest it’s almost perfect as far as volume goes. Maybe it’ll quiet up a little when the new tips get here

 

[GRNWNVY]

Anyone tried this yet?

fx180-Spool Performance FX-180 Upgraded High Pressure Fuel P

www.khartunerz.com

 

[General_Vodka]

Anyone tried this yet?

fx180-Spool Performance FX-180 Upgraded High Pressure Fuel P

www.khartunerz.com

Seems like a worse option. Even with both HPFP and LPFP you can't run full e85.

 

[Stiletto]

Nick at KHARTUNERZ has both Spool FPs in his ride.

 

[GRNWNVY]

And why could you not run full E85 after installing both? My assumption would be that the injectors can't flow enough fuel

 

[Stiletto]

Seems like a worse option. Even with both HPFP and LPFP you can't run full e85.

True. Which seems really odd to me.

 

[GRNWNVY]

and tuning of course

 

[General_Vodka]

And why could you not run full E85 after installing both? My assumption would be that the injectors can't flow enough fuel

It is the injectors. Pretty sure there is a thread somewhere about it

 

[Stiletto]

It is the injectors. Pretty sure there is a thread somewhere about it

According to Tork, the injectors flow enough. It's the hard lines, fuel rails and pressure dampeners that are the limiting factors.

It seems really odd that I was able to run full E85 on both my 2011 WRX (larger injectors and a tune were needed) and 2016 Focus RS (secondary fuel rail with Split Second controller were needed)...but we can't figure it out on this platform??

 

[General_Vodka]

According to Tork, the injectors flow enough. It's the hard lines, fuel rails and pressure dampeners that are the limiting factors.

It seems really odd that I was able to run full E85 on both my 2011 WRX (larger injectors and a tune were needed) and 2016 Focus RS (secondary fuel rail with Split Second controller were needed)...but we can't figure it out on this platform??

Now that you mention it, I do remember reading about the fuel rail limitations. Yeah full e85 would be neat, I know once tuned it can get some nice power. I lost to a full e85 evo X so yeah kinda sucks that I can't run full e85.

 

[GRNWNVY]

According to Tork, the injectors flow enough. It's the hard lines, fuel rails and pressure dampeners that are the limiting factors.

It seems really odd that I was able to run full E85 on both my 2011 WRX (larger injectors and a tune were needed) and 2016 Focus RS (secondary fuel rail with Split Second controller were needed)...but we can't figure it out on this platform??

Yup. 800 wheel hp was no problem with my 2017 5.0 Mustang. bolt on parts, tune, corn juice and done. Direct injection is dumb. The best though is dual injection where you get both port injectors and direct injectors. Gen 3 Coyote's have this, as well as several other manufacturer's and If I'm not mistaken, doesn't the 2.5 4 banger in the stinger and other Kia/Hyundai vehicles have this?

 

[playerbase]

There might be more out there but the only person I know of that was able to run just e85, and they had the Lap3 Stage 2.5 ECU & the JB4 CPI kit. It's definitely an expensive combo but for almost 500whp you can't complain. Also with the CPI kit I'm pretty sure Terry said you can run up to e40-e50 no issues, but after that you need an ECU tune.

So with the Lap3 ECU + the JB4 CPI Kit you can run full e85, but I'm assuming anything past e60-e65 won't make a difference since Lap3 said tune maxes out in the e60-e65 range. Nevertheless, I'd rather just fill up with ethanol and not have to worry about it.


I'm also on the edge about CPI & WMI. These are some factors I'm considering so they might also apply to you. My Stinger is my daily and I put on average 100-120 miles every day of the week on it. So fuel economy does matter to an extent to me, just enough to at least get 330-340+ miles out of a single tank. I know with running any ethanol mix it'll drop, I just don't know big of a drop it would be. With a WMI you get the best of both worlds technically speaking but for me it's not like e85 which I have down the street, but I also don't want to deal with having to mix ethanol all the time hence the reason to buy the lap3 ECU tune alongside the CPI kit to fill up with just e85 and not worry about it. Just another thing I'm also considering which might be a factor for you, while I won't have my foot to the floor all the time so I won't constantly be spraying meth, you get a full tank of e85 vs a 1-2 gallon tank of meth. Realistically how long is that tank of meth going to last for your driving style vs having a full tank of e85. In my eyes, I see WMI as more so of another "maintenance" item if you want to call it that, versus just filling e85 is just the same as filling gas as you always would.

 

[MikeG918]

There might be more out there but the only person I know of that was able to run just e85, and they had the Lap3 Stage 2.5 ECU & the JB4 CPI kit. It's definitely an expensive combo but for almost 500whp you can't complain. Also with the CPI kit I'm pretty sure Terry said you can run up to e40-e50 no issues, but after that you need an ECU tune.

So with the Lap3 ECU + the JB4 CPI Kit you can run full e85, but I'm assuming anything past e60-e65 won't make a difference since Lap3 said tune maxes out in the e60-e65 range. Nevertheless, I'd rather just fill up with ethanol and not have to worry about it.


I'm also on the edge about CPI & WMI. These are some factors I'm considering so they might also apply to you. My Stinger is my daily and I put on average 100-120 miles every day of the week on it. So fuel economy does matter to an extent to me, just enough to at least get 330-340+ miles out of a single tank. I know with running any ethanol mix it'll drop, I just don't know big of a drop it would be. With a WMI you get the best of both worlds technically speaking but for me it's not like e85 which I have down the street, but I also don't want to deal with having to mix ethanol all the time hence the reason to buy the lap3 ECU tune alongside the CPI kit to fill up with just e85 and not worry about it. Just another thing I'm also considering which might be a factor for you, while I won't have my foot to the floor all the time so I won't constantly be spraying meth, you get a full tank of e85 vs a 1-2 gallon tank of meth. Realistically how long is that tank of meth going to last for your driving style vs having a full tank of e85. In my eyes, I see WMI as more so of another "maintenance" item if you want to call it that, versus just filling e85 is just the same as filling gas as you always would.

So for me at least, mixing ethanol isn’t a big as deal as mixing water/meth all the time and the maintenance that goes with it (nozzle cleaning, solenoids failing, fittings leaking etc..) I will say that with the fuel it app, there’s no variables unless there is a faulty sensor, controller or injector. Which is also the case with wmi but at least in my eyes a fuel injector is specifically built to be reliable to an extent. I dealt with a wmi solenoid that failed open and that was not fun. So knowing the exact mix plus the calculator that’s in the app is nice and so far has been within 1 point.

I do 100% agree with you about the maintenance aspect of water/meth. I ran it on my old car for about 3 years and had to do a decent amount of maintenance to it. But it’s a hard choice to make since there’s so many added benefits to it. My car is also my daily but my commute is substantially less, 12 miles per day so mpg’s aren’t really a concern for me.

Most likely I’ll end up going the cpi route just for ease of use. After reading that link it’s definitely pushing me to that setup.

 

[44pirate]

So for me at least, mixing ethanol isn’t a big as deal as mixing water/meth all the time and the maintenance that goes with it (nozzle cleaning, solenoids failing, fittings leaking etc..) I will say that with the fuel it app, there’s no variables unless there is a faulty sensor, controller or injector. Which is also the case with wmi but at least in my eyes a fuel injector is specifically built to be reliable to an extent. I dealt with a wmi solenoid that failed open and that was not fun. So knowing the exact mix plus the calculator that’s in the app is nice and so far has been within 1 point.

I do 100% agree with you about the maintenance aspect of water/meth. I ran it on my old car for about 3 years and had to do a decent amount of maintenance to it. But it’s a hard choice to make since there’s so many added benefits to it. My car is also my daily but my commute is substantially less, 12 miles per day so mpg’s aren’t really a concern for me.

Most likely I’ll end up going the cpi route just for ease of use. After reading that link it’s definitely pushing me to that setup.

I had WMI for 6yrs never had an issue. I had the AEM 1gal tank. I would fill it every 2.5 fillups.. I never mixed the Meth with water.

 

[Stiletto]

There might be more out there but the only person I know of that was able to run just e85, and they had the Lap3 Stage 2.5 ECU & the JB4 CPI kit. It's definitely an expensive combo but for almost 500whp you can't complain. Also with the CPI kit I'm pretty sure Terry said you can run up to e40-e50 no issues, but after that you need an ECU tune.

So with the Lap3 ECU + the JB4 CPI Kit you can run full e85, but I'm assuming anything past e60-e65 won't make a difference since Lap3 said tune maxes out in the e60-e65 range

Not calling you a liar, but if Lap3 and CPI were the combo for full E85, I would think we'd have a BUNCH of Stingers running that (me included). Does the person you know with this set up post on any forums or groups?

 

[44pirate]

I had WMI for 6yrs never had an issue. I had the AEM 1gal tank. I would fill it every 2.5 fillups.. I never mixed the Meth with water.

I never had lines Eaton or deteriorate from 100% meth. None of fittings or what not that mister BMS says the negatives of WMI are. Cause you know they build these things to fail.

 

[General_Vodka]

I never had lines Eaton or deteriorate from 100% meth. None of fittings or what not that mister BMS says the negatives of WMI are. Cause you know they build these things to fail.

I have seen plastic become weak form 100% meth. You must have had quality plastic that is more resistant, since a lot of kits use cheap plastic for the tank and lines.

 

[44pirate]

I have seen plastic become weak form 100% meth. You must have had quality plastic that is more resistant, since a lot of kits use cheap plastic for the tank and lines.

Yes you get what you pay for. Why would you cheap out. There are alot of cheapos out there.