Engine Lifter Noise

[Sunbum]

Do all Stingers have a very loud, What I believe is lifter noise, on cold starts? Mine does. It last 30 seconds to a minute and sound like a diesel truck. It's quiet on warm starts. Kind of embarrassing considering what I paid for the car. DOn't hear it in an Audi S5 Sportback. I understand the noise happens because kia uses solid lifters instead of the hydraulic lifters like most manufacturers? Anyone know have this same issue and can confirm the cause? I went to the dealer and they said it was normal. I had them cold start a new one siting on the lot and it sounded the same.

 

[English D]

yep and then a small amount of lifter noise once warm

 

[Sunbum]

yep and then a small amount of lifter noise once warm

Thanks. Makes me feel better.

 

[Merkur720]

I rented a BMW 3 series (4 Cyl) a few months ago and it was unbelievable how noisy the engine was at start up. Like a diesel almost. But it was normal after warm up. The stinger isn’t bad at all in comparison.

 

[mldavis2]

I understand the noise happens because kia uses solid lifters instead of the hydraulic lifters like most manufacturers?

Really?! When I was a GM-Subaru-BMW service manager waaaay back in the '80's the Subarus had solid lifters. A real PITA because people would forget or just not bring them in for adjustment. An unnecessary expense in these days of hydraulics. I can't believe the lifters are solid.....

 

[EchoesMyron]

Yeah, it's a shim and bucket setup. So it has solid 'lifters' (typically called tappets in this configuration) with a shim of a specific thickness between the tappet and the valve stem to adjust the clearance between the cam lobe and the tappet (the valve clearance).

This is a high performance setup as the cam acts fairly directly on the valve and doesn't go through a rocker arm. fewer moving parts, less inertia, faster revving and more direct valve action. It also makes for a fairly easy dual variable valve timing setup.

This system has been used on a lot of engines but unfortunately, at least in theory, it does require valve clearance checks and possible adjustment. The clearance check isn't so bad but if any clearances need adjustment, the cams have to come out and the proper thickness shim placed under the tappet to get the appropriate clearance.

I do remember seeing a valve clearance check in the maintenance schedule but I can't remember what mileage it was at. In practice, if you do regular oil changes with quality oil, it probably won't ever need adjustment (but it's still good to check). If it ever does need adjustment, it will be quite an expensive procedure.

As far as tappet noise goes, I haven't noticed any on my car. other possible sources of noise could be the timing chain or minor piston slap when cold. Again, I haven't noticed any unusual noise from my engine at all on cold startup.

Hyundai and Kia have been using this engine in various forms for several years so any issues should be well known. It might be worth a search. Also keep in mind that older issues may have been solved with this most current generation.

While doing a quick Google search, I came across this video from Hyundai. Interesting.

In theory, a little lifter noise isn't going to hurt anything. It just means there's a little extra clearance..perhaps on the larger side of the spec. a little too much clearance is better than not enough in this case. Obviously, if it's really bad bring it to the dealer and have them check it out. All the Stingers are under warranty so at least you're taken care of if it's an actual problem.

 

[mldavis2]

Thanks, @EchoesMyron, very good visual of the engine. Short skirt pistons will likely rattle a little on cold starts like my LS2 and LS96's. If KIA thinks the engine will survive 100,000 miles without an expensive shim adjustment, it's probably good for the life of the car. I keep forgetting the powertrain warranty.

I do have a Maintenance Schedule for the 3.3 AWD and there is NO check or adjustment listed at any mileage up to and including 84,000 for valve lash adjustment.

 

[Adzismad2]

May I add. The cold start noise that you may be referring too might be caused by the high pressure fuel pump located on the left side of the v6

Mine is noticeably loud on cold start. And has been confirmed by my dealer as the source of the noise. It even has a sound cover over it.

Very similar to this

 

[mldavis2]

Interesting. Most electric fuel pumps will whine when the key is turned on, but since there is no key and everything is electrically sequential, it might be a source before the starter turns and the pressure is sufficient to atomize fuel at the nozzles. But a fuel pump motor noise is quite different from valve lash clatter, so I suspect there are two different noises being heard here.

 

[Adzismad2]

I have two videos of my v6 uploading now

One cold start video and one warm

Will post shortly

 

[Adzismad2]

Cold start

Warm

The dealer has already cleared this as normal.

 

[mldavis2]

Interesting. I guess this is well dampened by the hood being down. It must be a diaphragm or piston type pump to make that much noise. I don't recall hearing that much clatter when reviewers opened the hoods to show a running engine.

 

[Mach_Tuck]

Regarding shim adjustments...my 04 M3 has a similar shim/bucket setup and it requires inspection/adjustment every 30k. It's a fairly simple procedure just have to get to them. BMW makes a "special tool" used to retrieve/install the shim into the bucket and can be purchased online. Basically a plastic pick tool with a tiny magnet embedded.

Normally I need to "replace" about 5-7 shims per adjustment to tighten tolerances on 24 total valves.

If my M3 sounded like either of those videos I'd say it was time for an adjustment. Guess just have to learn what is normal for this engine.

Perhaps the loud noise comes from the direct injection as well. Those always seem to be loud?

 

[EchoesMyron]

This is the high pressure fuel pump for the direct injection system. It is not electric. The fuel pressure required for direct injection systems is typically several thousand psi and an electric pump can't do that. Port injection systems used only an electric pump and ran fuel pressures of 45-90psi depending on the manufacturer.

With the direct injection system, a traditional electric pump is used in the tank to send the fuel to the high pressure pump on the engine. The high pressure pump then sends fuel to the injectors.

It didn't occur to me previously but I would bet the high pressure pump is the cause of the noise; good call by @Adzismad2. I'm fairly sure he's correct on this issue.

 

[mldavis2]

I wonder how much a service manual costs....they are not cheap, but it would answer a lot of questions.

 

[EchoesMyron]

I wonder how much a service manual costs....they are not cheap, but it would answer a lot of questions.

Most manufacturers don't even print paper service manuals anymore. All service information is electronic and available to dealership techs through a manufacturer login.

There are 3rd party service information sources like Alldata or Mitchell on Demand. I have access to both through work. You can buy a subscription to just one vehicle. I'm not sure how much it costs but a trip to either website will let you know. The only problem is that Kia won't likely release much service info to these companies until the car is out of warranty. Right now on Alldata, they don't even list the Stinger at all. Initially, all they are likely to release is basic maintenance information which would probably be handy.

 

[Rufus]

If I'm not mistaken, I'm pretty sure that is the sound of a cold direct-injection motor...

 

[STINGER]

Cold start

Warm

The dealer has already cleared this as normal.

Sounds like a construction site.

 

[Adzismad2]

Sounds like a construction site.

It does, just on cold though ^.^

 

[Bwebb]

After much research, in the past, from owning back to back optimas I will weigh in that this noisy startup from cold is normal. It has been the case for, now that I have my Stinger, all three of my 2013+ Kia GDI engines. Don’t sweat the small stuff. Listen to the boosted engine in a Chrysler 200 and you will relax. That thing sounds like a jet engine and it stay pretty loud even after warm: