3.3TT Cylinder #6 Misfire

[ScottyDangles]

Hey Guys -

Does anyone know which cylinder is cylinder #6? I have a misfire under load and think I might have a bad spark plug. I just want to go in and change it rather than take it to the dealer.

In case this is important I have the BMS JB4 with Denso plugs gapped at .025. I know terry recommends .022, he has also confirmed .025 should not be an issue.

Thanks,
Scott

 

[Hydrajin]

Blew cyl3, had it replaced and blew out again as soon as I drove out of the dealership. Installed a set of Denso ikh27, pushed it as hard as I could a launched it a few times to simulate most severe scenarios of heat soak and maximum boost. Densos haven't blown yet. I figured it was a core expansion of the plug that caused that type of crack and the densos are 2 steps colder so they should holder up to the heat. I gaped them to .022-.023 before installing them.

Those denso plugs do look fancy, brass connection and all.

 

[Hydrajin]

Hey Guys -

Does anyone know which cylinder is cylinder #6? I have a misfire under load and think I might have a bad spark plug. I just want to go in and change it rather than take it to the dealer.

In case this is important I have the BMS JB4 with Denso plugs gapped at .025. I know terry recommends .022, he has also confirmed .025 should not be an issue.

Thanks,
Scott

If you bought the ikh24 Denso plugs good chances you may have blown them, they're only 1 step colder which is borderline enough for stock car, my plugs cracked without a tune or chip, stock boost levels cracked them.

 

[ScottyDangles]

If you bought the ikh24 Denso plugs good chances you may have blown them, they're only 1 step colder which is borderline enough for stock car, my plugs cracked without a tune or chip, stock boost levels cracked them.

Interesting, I guess I better keep a watchful eye on this.

My plug isn't completely blown, it's misfiring under heavy load, but obviously it's going to go anytime so I need to change it. For now the dealer has reset the code and the car is fine as long as I don't go hard on it.

Do you or anyone on the forum know which spark plug I need to change if #6 is misfiring? I'm thinking it will either be the driver or passenger spark plugs closest to the firewall?

 

[Hydrajin]

Interesting, I guess I better keep a watchful eye on this.

My plug isn't completely blown, it's misfiring under heavy load, but obviously it's going to go anytime so I need to change it. For now the dealer has reset the code and the car is fine as long as I don't go hard on it.

Do you or anyone on the forum know which spark plug I need to change if #6 is misfiring? I'm thinking it will either be the driver or passenger spark plugs closest to the firewall?

Yeh it misfired under load because as boost builds the combustion gets hotter heating the plug core and expanding the porcelain open an shorting. If short is detected for more than 5 seconds, or something along those lines, the engine shuts down that cylinder by cutting power to the coil. Exactly what had happened to me, it drove normal for the past 2 weeks it has had a blown plug just couldn't get on the gas at all if I want to accelerate... Prius driver's were fed up lol.

My car only has 17k km, kia rejected warranty because plugs are "wear and tear". kia really messed up on this one, they've got to cover these crap stock plugs or recall for new plugs. The dealership was so happy my plug was blowing out repeatedly, it ensured a weekly income of $225 for them; or so they thought. I ordered denso ikh27 plugs at $13 each from a canadian online retailer, a lot cheaper than hks plugs and arguably better because of the finer center electrode.

As for cylinder 6, it's the driver side back cylinder towards the fire wall. Attached a diagram of cylinder number / firing order.

 

[ScottyDangles]

Yeh it misfired under load because as boost builds the combustion gets hotter heating the plug core and expanding the porcelain open an shorting. If short is detected for more than 5 seconds, or something along those lines, the engine shuts down that cylinder by cutting power to the coil. Exactly what had happened to me, it drove normal for the past 2 weeks it has had a blown plug just couldn't get on the gas at all if I want to accelerate... Prius driver's were fed up lol.

My car only has 17k km, kia rejected warranty because plugs are "wear and tear". kia really messed up on this one, they've got to cover these crap stock plugs or recall for new plugs. The dealership was so happy my plug was blowing out repeatedly, it ensured a weekly income of $225 for them; or so they thought. I ordered denso ikh27 plugs at $13 each from a canadian online retailer, a lot cheaper than hks plugs and arguably better because of the finer center electrode.

As for cylinder 6, it's the driver side back cylinder towards the fire wall. Attached a diagram of cylinder number / firing order.

LOL ya I hate not being able to stomp on it!!! I thought I was going to die when the car shut cylinder 6 down, thank God it came back after a restart.

Thanks for the diagram. Interestingly before I got your message I called the dealership and asked which was the #6 cylinder and the dealer told me it was the passenger rear. Based on how much you seem to know about this and how non-chalant the mechanic was at my dealer my money is on your diagram being correct. By the way how much did you torque down the spark plugs, I was thinking 20ft/pds?

You know what's super cool, I was told this week all four brake rotors were warped. (Yes I've seen the extensive thread specifically about this) They are going to try for warranty, I doubt it will be covered. I have just under 40K but have been complaining about the brakes since at least 15K.

By the way you in the GTA?

 

[Shrikecorp]

Yeh it misfired under load because as boost builds the combustion gets hotter heating the plug core and expanding the porcelain open an shorting. If short is detected for more than 5 seconds, or something along those lines, the engine shuts down that cylinder by cutting power to the coil. Exactly what had happened to me, it drove normal for the past 2 weeks it has had a blown plug just couldn't get on the gas at all if I want to accelerate... Prius driver's were fed up lol.

My car only has 17k km, kia rejected warranty because plugs are "wear and tear". kia really messed up on this one, they've got to cover these crap stock plugs or recall for new plugs. The dealership was so happy my plug was blowing out repeatedly, it ensured a weekly income of $225 for them; or so they thought. I ordered denso ikh27 plugs at $13 each from a canadian online retailer, a lot cheaper than hks plugs and arguably better because of the finer center electrode.

As for cylinder 6, it's the driver side back cylinder towards the fire wall. Attached a diagram of cylinder number / firing order.

Thanks for posting this - either my Google-fu is terrible or this is hard info to come by.

 

[Doel]

LOL ya I hate not being able to stomp on it!!! I thought I was going to die when the car shut cylinder 6 down, thank God it came back after a restart.

Thanks for the diagram. Interestingly before I got your message I called the dealership and asked which was the #6 cylinder and the dealer told me it was the passenger rear. Based on how much you seem to know about this and how non-chalant the mechanic was at my dealer my money is on your diagram being correct. By the way how much did you torque down the spark plugs, I was thinking 20ft/pds?

You know what's super cool, I was told this week all four brake rotors were warped. (Yes I've seen the extensive thread specifically about this) They are going to try for warranty, I doubt it will be covered. I have just under 40K but have been complaining about the brakes since at least 15K.

By the way you in the GTA?

have you tried to burn off the deposits off the rotors?

 

[ScottyDangles]

have you tried to burn off the deposits off the rotors?

How do I do that? Guaranteed rotors are fine and its pad deposits on the rotors.

 

[Hydrajin]

LOL ya I hate not being able to stomp on it!!! I thought I was going to die when the car shut cylinder 6 down, thank God it came back after a restart.

Thanks for the diagram. Interestingly before I got your message I called the dealership and asked which was the #6 cylinder and the dealer told me it was the passenger rear. Based on how much you seem to know about this and how non-chalant the mechanic was at my dealer my money is on your diagram being correct. By the way how much did you torque down the spark plugs, I was thinking 20ft/pds?

You know what's super cool, I was told this week all four brake rotors were warped. (Yes I've seen the extensive thread specifically about this) They are going to try for warranty, I doubt it will be covered. I have just under 40K but have been complaining about the brakes since at least 15K.

By the way you in the GTA?

Shutdown cylinder and restart to normal definitely sounds like blown plug, exact sumpsymp I had, have a look at the plug, torque for it is 30nm (don't recall how much that is in ft/lb but wrenches all specify both NM and ft/lb, torque for the coil bolt is only 11nm so don't push too much on that one.
Don't go to that dealership that's for sure lol.
My brakes have been warped since 6k on the car, not warped but rather pad material baked in. By the way there is the service manual on here for the AWD gt, it's the same for the red in terms of engine and body sections of the manual I would imagine but you probably have the AWD anyways.
I'm in Ottawa.

 

[Doel]

How do I do that? Guaranteed rotors are fine and its pad deposits on the rotors.

several really hard stops from 60 mph in quick succession then cruise without stopping to let them cool off. Hot pads left on one spot on the rotor (when you're at a stop light for instance) will leave deposits on it. It's temporary, it will always come back. Definitely need new pads long term.

 

[ScottyDangles]

Yeh it misfired under load because as boost builds the combustion gets hotter heating the plug core and expanding the porcelain open an shorting. If short is detected for more than 5 seconds, or something along those lines, the engine shuts down that cylinder by cutting power to the coil. Exactly what had happened to me, it drove normal for the past 2 weeks it has had a blown plug just couldn't get on the gas at all if I want to accelerate... Prius driver's were fed up lol.

My car only has 17k km, kia rejected warranty because plugs are "wear and tear". kia really messed up on this one, they've got to cover these crap stock plugs or recall for new plugs. The dealership was so happy my plug was blowing out repeatedly, it ensured a weekly income of $225 for them; or so they thought. I ordered denso ikh27 plugs at $13 each from a canadian online retailer, a lot cheaper than hks plugs and arguably better because of the finer center electrode.

As for cylinder 6, it's the driver side back cylinder towards the fire wall. Attached a diagram of cylinder number / firing order.

Bingo Bango Bongo! Look at that Sparky all banged up.

Appreciate the help! Car runs like a top. Question is will the IKH24s hold up...

 

[Revvdmedia]

Bingo Bango Bongo! Look at that Sparky all banged up.

Appreciate the help! Car runs like a top. Question is will the IKH24s hold up...

Weird, I don't hear many complains of people blowing the Densos once installed, heard more about rough idle than anything. What map were you running? Interesting to see Densos blowing...

 

[Hydrajin]

Bingo Bango Bongo! Look at that Sparky all banged up.

Appreciate the help! Car runs like a top. Question is will the IKH24s hold up...

The ikh24 would hold up well for the 2.0L the V6 has a little more heat in its combustion, especially when overboosting with the JB4, the ikh27 is a much better application for you. You can upgrade each one as it goes or you can just swap them all out. The ikh27s are relatively cheap so it wouldn't hurt to do all of them and sleep better at night lol.

The ikh24, I believe, is a heat range 8 (NGK range) while the ikh27 is a 9.
I bought my ikh27s off wrenchmonkey for about 13 CAD each, I got 8 just to get the free shipping rather than pay shipping that adds up to nearly the same price lol.

 

[ScottyDangles]

Weird, I don't hear many complains of people blowing the Densos once installed, heard more about rough idle than anything. What map were you running? Interesting to see Densos blowing...

I was surprised as well, I've been running Map 2, I have never used Map 3. Tough to say if my Kia dealer gapped the plugs properly. Suffice to say I will be putting in my own plugs going forward and like going with Hydrajin's recommendation. Just not looking forward to doing the plugs on the passenger side, damn intake manifold!!

 

[ScottyDangles]

The ikh24 would hold up well for the 2.0L the V6 has a little more heat in its combustion, especially when overboosting with the JB4, the ikh27 is a much better application for you. You can upgrade each one as it goes or you can just swap them all out. The ikh27s are relatively cheap so it wouldn't hurt to do all of them and sleep better at night lol.

The ikh24, I believe, is a heat range 8 (NGK range) while the ikh27 is a 9.
I bought my ikh27s off wrenchmonkey for about 13 CAD each, I got 8 just to get the free shipping rather than pay shipping that adds up to nearly the same price lol.

I think I'll follow your lead and do this. Did you end up taking off the intake manifold when changing the plugs?

 

[Hydrajin]

I think I'll follow your lead and do this. Did you end up taking off the intake manifold when changing the plugs?

Yeh, cylinder 1 is very hard to get to without removing it and removing 3 is pretty much impossible without removing the surge tank. Carefully disconnect all engine front facing harness connections, the throttle body and charge pipe connections, and the 2 back (firewall side) connections attached to the surge tank and removing the surge tank is a breeze. You can actually just push it out of the way, no need to completely remove it from the engine because I found the hoses on the bottom of the throttle body are ugly to work with. There are a couple of hoses you will need to disconnect from the surge tank to move it from its place, they are around the back of the engine/tank. And to twist the surge tank up to move it out of the way you need to loosen the large hose clamp on the throttle body end, loosen it to a point it wiggles freely on the hose.

Torque on the surge tank bolts and all other harness securing bolts is 11nm, the big bolt on the lower side of the surge tank is 30nm. Torque of the hose clamp is 6nm. If you found the manual, you don't need to follow it step for step as it wants you to completely remove the harness all together and remove the surge tank all together, I just disconnected what is necessary to remove them out of the way.

In the photo you can see what I mean by twist away the surge tank, same applies to the harness, once it's loose enough to fold over on its top end just fold it away and you have full access to all plugs comfortably.

 

[Shrikecorp]

I think I'll follow your lead and do this. Did you end up taking off the intake manifold when changing the plugs?

You could also have a look at How to remove and install spark plugs for your Kia Stinger. Though if I'm honest I may do the remove intake method myself next time. #3 was a bear, though mostly because my combination of socket, swivels, and extensions kept separating...most often leaving the spark plug socket by itself and hard to reach. I think with tools that more firmly attached to each other it would have been pretty easy. The rest were.

 

[Revvdmedia]

You could also have a look at How to remove and install spark plugs for your Kia Stinger. Though if I'm honest I may do the remove intake method myself next time. #3 was a bear, though mostly because my combination of socket, swivels, and extensions kept separating...most often leaving the spark plug socket by itself and hard to reach. I think with tools that more firmly attached to each other it would have been pretty easy. The rest were.

I used a magnetic socket that has the swiveling built in extension, then swivels and extensions from there. I actually had no issue with that plug under the manifold arm. The most difficult part was removing the coil pack, but that was easier when I separated boot from the pack. Just need to be sure everything is pushed down together when you put it back in.

 

[Kato_the_kia_stinger]

Does anyone have the firing order handy so I can locate which cylinder is misfiring?