Snow tires + AWD?

Oh, and I let it warm up a wee bit before gingerly motoring along until she's warmed up.
Watch out for that "non-gaseous extra gasoline". ;) Or don't worry about it, like me. I rolled as soon as I started up and my engine and interior didn't warm up faster. Besides, I was idling down the road; the RPM were almost the same as warming up in my driveway.
 
Watch out for that "non-gaseous extra gasoline". ;) Or don't worry about it, like me. I rolled as soon as I started up and my engine and interior didn't warm up faster. Besides, I was idling down the road; the RPM were almost the same as warming up in my driveway.
The man has a valid point - fuel injected following a cold start does not vaporize as quickly, which results in extra 'liquid' gasoline in the cylinder. If you want to read a raft of technical papers on it, try searching on 'GDI engine cold start fuel vaporization'.

As the engine is doing useful work (pulling a reasonably heavy car down the road) while driving, it will warm up faster than if simply idling - so reduce the time your engine is subject to the effects of non-vaporized fuel.

Besides, with driving vs. idling you are actually getting a MPG result above zero, and giving a purpose to the emissions produced. :thumbup: That's why more and more governments are passing laws against excessive idling.
 
That's why more and more governments are passing laws against excessive idling.
Governments are mostly interested in looking good. Our cars burn cleanly. The emissions difference between idling and driving is minimal.
As the engine is doing useful work (pulling a reasonably heavy car down the road) while driving, it will warm up faster than if simply idling - so reduce the time your engine is subject to the effects of non-vaporized fuel.
I didn't see any difference in how quickly my engine got up to operating temperature, idling or motoring down the road conservatively. Now, if I put the go pedal down right away, that would warm things up faster. But I won't abuse the engine just to get it to warm up faster just to vaporize the gas better/quicker.
 
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Governments are mostly interested in looking good. Our cars burn cleanly. The emissions difference between idling and driving is minimal.
You're missing the point. A car idling is getting zero miles per gallon, producing emissions, and going nowhere. When you're finished idling, now you have to burn more fuel to get where you are going.

I didn't see any difference in how quickly my engine got up to operating temperature, idling or motoring down the road conservatively.
You may not notice it, but there is a difference. The car 'driven conservatively' is still doing work, and will always warm up faster than a car idling.
 
You're missing the point. A car idling is getting zero miles per gallon, producing emissions, and going nowhere. When you're finished idling, now you have to burn more fuel to get where you are going.
Not missing the point: How is my gas mileage anyone else's concern but my own? If I want to get crap average mpg and spare my cold engine, that's my choice. The environment doesn't care if I am rolling or sitting. Earth has plenty of fossil fuel reserves.
You may not notice it, but there is a difference. The car 'driven conservatively' is still doing work, and will always warm up faster than a car idling.
I am going to do keep doing this, and leave off idling in the driveway. For now. I may change my mind again (not merely the privilege of women:)).
 
From interior to exterior to high performance - everything you need for your Stinger awaits you...
Not missing the point: How is my gas mileage anyone else's concern but my own? If I want to get crap average mpg and spare my cold engine, that's my choice. The environment doesn't care if I am rolling or sitting. Earth has plenty of fossil fuel reserves.
The point is you said 'the emissions difference between idling and driving is minimal'. The problem is you aren't going anywhere when idling - so your trip to the grocery store actually generates significantly more in the way of emissions, when you travel the same distance, but spend time idling beforehand. Yes, the environment does 'care' whether you, and everyone else, are rolling or sitting. :(

That is why governments are cracking down on idling time, not because it 'looks good'. Idling = zero miles per gallon, and infinite emissions/mile, something most governments are making an effort to address.
 
The point is you said 'the emissions difference between idling and driving is minimal'. The problem is you aren't going anywhere when idling - so your trip to the grocery store actually generates significantly more in the way of emissions, when you travel the same distance, but spend time idling beforehand. Yes, the environment does 'care' whether you, and everyone else, are rolling or sitting. :(

That is why governments are cracking down on idling time, not because it 'looks good'. Idling = zero miles per gallon, and infinite emissions/mile, something most governments are making an effort to address.
I deleted my knee jerk response. This is heading into political agenda territory. End of discussion by me.
 
Back to your regularly scheduled programming. AWD and snow tires, anyone? :)
 
Back to your regularly scheduled programming. AWD and snow tires, anyone? :)
OK.... We're getting some serious winter now after below average snow so far. Took the #1 daughter to birthday dinner after work. Probably 4 in. of snow in 4 hours. Main roads were bad with the polished snow and all the knuckleheads who can't be bothered to pay attention. Got on to the side roads a few miles from home. Put it in Sport and turned TC off. The snow tires (Michelin Ice-X) performed great. Plenty of grip to inspire confidence, but on-demand slip to power out of the oversteer. What fun to steer with the rear wheels and throttle! Who needs RWD and dry roads!? :p
Edit to add pic. She even looks great (better?) with all that snow dust!
snow2.webp
 
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From interior to exterior to high performance - everything you need for your Stinger awaits you...
I just ordered a set of these 18-inch BBS 5/10 spoke design (resembles the stock 19's) wheels with Michelin X-ICE tires.
Looks like those will be a great winter rim. No exposed machined surfaces, a nice open design that should help in keeping clean, and a wide, angled flange to keep the snow and such out. And it'a a looker as well! :thumbup:
 
From interior to exterior to high performance - everything you need for your Stinger awaits you...
Watch out for that "non-gaseous extra gasoline". ;) Or don't worry about it, like me. I rolled as soon as I started up and my engine and interior didn't warm up faster. Besides, I was idling down the road; the RPM were almost the same as warming up in my driveway.

Why do you have to be so hostile when your convictions are challenged? I am not a native English speaker so yes, some of the terms I use may sound funny. You can choose to ridicule me, or to act like adults do.

But maybe Popular Mechanics can explain the issue using terminology that you can accept.

Warming Up Your Car in the Cold Just Harms the Engine

When your engine is cold, the gasoline is less likely to evaporate and create the correct ratio of air and vaporized fuel for combustion. Engines with electronic fuel injection have sensors that compensate for the cold by pumping more gasoline into the mixture. The engine continues to run rich in this way until it heats up to about 40 degrees Fahrenheit.

"That's a problem because you're actually putting extra fuel into the combustion chamber to make it burn and some of it can get onto the cylinder walls," Stephen Ciatti, a mechanical engineer who specializes in combustion engines at the Argonne National Laboratory, told Business Insider. "Gasoline is an outstanding solvent and it can actually wash oil off the walls if you run it in those cold idle conditions for an extended period of time."

The life of components like piston rings and cylinder liners can be significantly reduced by gasoline washing away the lubricating oil, not to mention the extra fuel that is used while the engine runs rich. Driving your car is the fastest way to warm the engine up to 40 degrees so it switches back to a normal fuel to air ratio. Even though warm air generated by the heater core will flow into the cabin after a few minutes, idling does surprisingly little to warm the actual engine.
 
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But maybe Popular Mechanics can explain the issue using terminology that you can accept.
Thanks - that's a good (and recent) reference, which nicely covers the cold FI engine issue with poor gasoline vaporization. The article also had a nice close, quoting a respected auto manufacturer renowned for their winter performance testing.

We asked Volvo, which conducts cold-weather testing in the Arctic, whether their new cars need any sort of warmup, and the answer was an ever-so-slightly qualified no. According to Volvo, "It’s best to just give the engine a few seconds to build oil pressure before driving normally. Good oil quality and condition are crucial for protecting the engine in cold start conditions."

So unless you're rolling in a 1970s Chevelle—which we assume isn't your daily driver—bundle up, get into that cold car, and get it moving.

I mentioned this before in another thread - a direct quote from the Stinger owner's manual, under 'Driving your Vehicle'.

Do not wait for the engine to warm up while the vehicle remains stationary.
Start driving at moderate engine speeds. (Steep accelerating and decelerating should be avoided.)
 
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Why do you have to be so hostile when your convictions are challenged? I am not a native English speaker so yes, some of the terms I use may sound funny. You can choose to ridicule me, or to act like adults do.

But maybe Popular Mechanics can explain the issue using terminology that you can accept.

Warming Up Your Car in the Cold Just Harms the Engine
Apologies, @kaius. I did think about my use of humor and decided (poorly) to go ahead. I wasn't even thinking of the language and resulting cultural frictions. I understood your terminology, even though the entire subject of unburned (extra) gasses is new to me.

Thanks for the link! :thumbup:

And I don't know how you get "hostile" out of the resulting reversal of "my convictions": I am rolling almost right after I start, now. So all you all have convinced me to go with that instead of idling and warming up.
 
Do not wait for the engine to warm up while the vehicle remains stationary.
Start driving at moderate engine speeds. (Steep accelerating and decelerating should be avoided.)
Ah, missed that bit. So much for the "walking manual" appellation. recently given to me. :rolleyes::P:)
 
I understand what you are saying about wanting to enjoy driving all the time. So far, just being IN the Stinger is enjoyable. So I don't mind driving very conservatively, not pushing for any limits, with these A/S tires when the roads are total crap. As @Jimmer pointed out, in the metro areas of SLC (really the entire Wasatch Front, not in the canyons), those kinds of bad weather days are not that common; with periods lasting days or even weeks up near 50F, sometimes even above that. So the few times we have to back off are justified by the bulk of days where winter tires would drive a driver like you nuts. Surely, you're not advocating swapping tires weekly?
I'm in the central portion of the state of Illinois. The absolute last day of the year I will wait to mount my winter wheels and tires is November 12th. We almost never have snow before then, but temps can change wildly. I won't remove them for summers until April 15th. My first day of a groundskeeping job in high school was spent shoveling the 5 inches of snow that had dropped the night before.
 
From interior to exterior to high performance - everything you need for your Stinger awaits you...
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