I think I got scammed

[brancky3]

But typically, normally, leasing is for people who can't afford the higher monthly payments of financing to buy. Leasing allows lower monthly payments.

That's quite a broad stroke you just painted... In my case I lease because I get bored with cars pretty easily and don't want to commit, definitely not because I can't afford a Kia.

 

[GenesisG70]

Yeah that 5500 for just interest (rent charge) seems to be too much. I will ask what's the money factor they used

 

[MerlintheMad]

That's quite a broad stroke you just painted... In my case I lease because I get bored with cars pretty easily and don't want to commit, definitely not because I can't afford a Kia.

Not mutually exclusive reasons why people lease. Lower monthly payments are a big reason for leasing. Disenchantment with a car is another reason. A Soul can be leased for under $200/month. A Stinger leases for over $600/month. So "I lease because I can't afford to buy a Kia" can be true since $1,000/month is a considerable outlay of cash each month if you want to buy one.

 

[Kamauxx]

That's quite a broad stroke you just painted... In my case I lease because I get bored with cars pretty easily and don't want to commit, definitely not because I can't afford a Kia.

You're right. Most luxury cars (BMW, Mercedes, Audi) are leased for a similar reason. People want the new/more modern models with the new tech/fancy features. Those cars lease for more than it takes to finance one. Typically they require large down payments and $700+ per month.

The Stinger may be an expensive Kia but it isn't an expensive car. Most people with a full time job and decent management of their finances can afford a Stinger.

 

[MerlintheMad]

Yeah that 5500 for just interest (rent charge) seems to be too much. I will ask what's the money factor they used

Perhaps. I don't know enough about money factor. But my rent is shown as $5774.86.

 

[Peeso33]

Those "who know" leasing on this forum have in the past advised to not dicker over monthly payment. But I don't know what the practical difference is: if you only go in with a maximum price out the door, and monthly payment isn't an object for discussion, how does leasing make sense in the first place? I know: Kia incentives on the Stinger. That is the game changer: with leasing rebates sometimes in the $9K range (!?) it makes sense to get as much of that as possible and then do the buyout.

But typically, normally, leasing is for people who can't afford the higher monthly payments of financing to buy. Leasing allows lower monthly payments. So dickering over a maximum monthly payment (as you did) seems logical to me if you are not going to exercise the buyout. If you expect both a lower monthly payment and then do the buyout, why bother fighting for a lower monthly payment?

Lower monthly payment results in less of the Kia lease rebate/incentive applying. The dealer will tack on added costs and fees to reap a profit, gouging the incentive to nothing (It looks like the OP's incentive exactly equals the amount of the first payment). But if you go for a higher monthly payment and lower out the door price, then the incentive will apply more to get to the lower agreed price, and then you do the buyout and reap the reward of a lower out the door price.

(I am inviting correction/education on this: because leasing was entirely new to me a year ago, and I have slowly pounded what I think I understand about it into my middle aged brain. No doubt this is yet one more area where I know far less than there is to know.)

I own a small business. Car leasing is write-off for me. I CAN afford to buy, but sometimes choose to lease to make accounting easier, as it doesn't involve depreciating the car over time.
The reason to not focus on the monthly lease payment is because, ultimately monthly payment is calculated based on
-MSRP and residual value (which dealers cannot change)
-Final selling price (what you can negotiate off from the dealer)
-MF (Money Factor which dealers often secretly mark up ), it's the lease equivalent of APR.
-Known rebate/lease cash. You don't ask for it, the dealers will keep it.

In an ideal situation, you would know all of the above numbers, before deciding if the monthly payment is a good deal or not. A simple monthly payment dollar amount doesn't tell you the MF, how much discount or if any rebate are included. I would never buy a car without knowing the selling price or APR on my loan, it would only make sense to do the same for a lease.

 

[GenesisG70]

I own a small business. Car leasing is write-off for me. I CAN afford to buy, but sometimes choose to lease to make accounting easier, as it doesn't involve depreciating the car over time.
The reason to not focus on the monthly lease payment is because, ultimately monthly payment is calculated based on
-MSRP and residual value (which dealers cannot change)
-Final selling price (what you can negotiate off from the dealer)
-MF (Money Factor which dealers often secretly mark up ), it's the lease equivalent of APR.
-Known rebate/lease cash. You don't ask for it, the dealers will keep it.

In an ideal situation, you would know all of the above numbers, before deciding if the monthly payment is a good deal or not. A simple monthly payment dollar amount doesn't tell you the MF, how much discount or if any rebate are included. I would never buy a car without knowing the selling price or APR on my loan, it would only make sense to do the same for a lease.

I thought msrp is something dealers can change and you can negotiate so what you are saying the most important thing when leasing is getting a low money factor, and can you explain what is you mean when you said you must know the selling price? Is that the msrp or residual? Also how to detect stealerships are secretly increasing MF?

 

[MerlintheMad]

-Known rebate/lease cash. You don't ask for it, the dealers will keep it.

We didn't know about it going in. But we approached the dealer with wanting to pay cash up front; how much would they discount for that? And they said leasing was a bigger savings and showed us the Kia incentive amount (which was impressive on site, but later didn't seem as big when I came here and saw incentives two thousand and more higher than what we got). If we hadn't offered cash, I still think the dealer would have gone through our options. So not all dealers will "keep it".

 

[Peeso33]

MF and incentives usally vary by region. edmunds usually will give this out if you ask 2019 Kia Stinger Lease Deals and Prices - Page 6

-The vehicle's residual value is calculated as a % of the MSRP (without any dealer add ons), the higher the residual, the lower your payment. Dealers cannot change the residual.
-If your lease is through Kia financial, they will have a Base MF. But often, dealerships will add on top of that MF, and the dealerships (not Kia Financial) will get to keep that as profit. If you don't know that base MF, and if you don't know what MF the dealerships gave you, you may or may not be getting ripped off.

I still think you got a good deal, maybe not the full $11000 off that you were promised. It's just the OCD in me that wants to know all the numbers.

 

[Peeso33]

We didn't know about it going in. But we approached the dealer with wanting to pay cash up front; how much would they discount for that? And they said leasing was a bigger savings and showed us the Kia incentive amount (which was impressive on site, but later didn't seem as big when I came here and saw incentives two thousand and more higher than what we got). If we hadn't offered cash, I still think the dealer would have gone through our options. So not all dealers will "keep it".

I'm sure you did fine. Next time, find out about the MF and lease incentive before taking the dealerships' word for it. Besides, they probably HAD to charge you a bit more for such a perfect Stinger. You know a Stinger without paint chip, rattle or noise of any kind goes for a premium around here. btw, nice new rims.

 

[Chark]

There are Auto Lease Calculators online that will give you a breakdown of all the numbers. With the info you provided, and guesses on money factor and tax rate, it was showing an interest rate of around 4.5%. That’s not bad and certainly not excessive. Stop worrying and enjoy your new vehicle!

 

[GenesisG70]

There are Auto Lease Calculators online that will give you a breakdown of all the numbers. With the info you provided, and guesses on money factor and tax rate, it was showing an interest rate of around 4.5%. That’s not bad and certainly not excessive. Stop worrying and enjoy your new vehicle!

Agreed sir!! Will do again thanks so much.

 

[MerlintheMad]

Besides, they probably HAD to charge you a bit more for such a perfect Stinger. You know a Stinger without paint chip, rattle or noise of any kind goes for a premium around here.

LOL! I actually FEEL that way after learning of the problems others have experienced. I'd take trouble free over a killer deal any day. (Of course, knowledge and swinging a killer deal, and then getting a trouble free car on top of that, is the way to go; and I enjoy reading about how others have swung those fantastic deals and on top of that don't have issues.)

btw, nice new rims.

Thanks.

 

[David C Dubbin]

Window tinting nitrogen in tires and paint protection film on door edges, from them numbers u see above do you think I got ripped?

Perhaps there is a different import regulation of here or Kia has just decided to have all of their Canadian delivered cars delivered with Nitrogen filled tires. Mine was as were the last three Kias that other family members have purchased in the last two years. As I posted earlier at full MSRP the dealer maked about $1700.00. That is the spiffs on the back end in the business is so import to the store. More often tban not the store will make more money on the deal on the back end then they will make on the front end portion of the sale. I don't think you got ripped off at all. My only complaint would be the $1800.00 in spiffs they tried to sneak into the deal on the back end. Doing thus on a lease deal is much easier because of their ability to play with the numbers. Good for you for picking up on at deliver and telling to pound sand. I hope you can still enjoy the car. It will start to loosen up at about 3000 - 5000 miles at which you will have a lot of fun. Enjoy!

 

[Lonz]

Must admit, I'm not entirely too familiar with how leases work, however, isn't the "Adjusted Capital Cost" considered the price at which the dealership sold the loan to the bank? I remember reading somewhere that if you're going to lease a vehicle, do not necessarily focus your monthly payment, but rather focus on how low you can get the "Adjusted Capital Cost" to, after all rebates, dealer fees, add-ons, etc.

 

[jatleson]

Those "who know" leasing on this forum have in the past advised to not dicker over monthly payment. But I don't know what the practical difference is: if you only go in with a maximum price out the door, and monthly payment isn't an object for discussion, how does leasing make sense in the first place? I know: Kia incentives on the Stinger. That is the game changer: with leasing rebates sometimes in the $9K range (!?) it makes sense to get as much of that as possible and then do the buyout.

But typically, normally, leasing is for people who can't afford the higher monthly payments of financing to buy. Leasing allows lower monthly payments. So dickering over a maximum monthly payment (as you did) seems logical to me if you are not going to exercise the buyout. If you expect both a lower monthly payment and then do the buyout, why bother fighting for a lower monthly payment?

Lower monthly payment results in less of the Kia lease rebate/incentive applying. The dealer will tack on added costs and fees to reap a profit, gouging the incentive to nothing (It looks like the OP's incentive exactly equals the amount of the first payment). But if you go for a higher monthly payment and lower out the door price, then the incentive will apply more to get to the lower agreed price, and then you do the buyout and reap the reward of a lower out the door price.

(I am inviting correction/education on this: because leasing was entirely new to me a year ago, and I have slowly pounded what I think I understand about it into my middle aged brain. No doubt this is yet one more area where I know far less than there is to know.)

ElfGuy beat me to it buy a bit, but leasing is not just a means to get more car than you can afford. You said it your self, hard to pass up the incentives they are offering on leases. Leases also offer tax incentives if you own businesses or use the car for business. There are legit reason to lease a car other than getting more car than you could afford.

Honestly, I was with you until I started digging into best way to get into a Stinger. I always bought cars and either paid it up front or got a loan. Typically I keep my vehicles a long time. With the incentives Kia is offering on leasing Stingers and assuming your credit is decent you will not get a better deal than leasing the car and buying out the lease (assuming no penalty like on KMF leases). Interest rates that credit unions offer are the same as the rates Kia offers, even if slightly higher, they don't add up to the $8000+ incentive you can get.

 

[MerlintheMad]

With the incentives Kia is offering on leasing Stingers and assuming your credit is decent you will not get a better deal than leasing the car and buying out the lease (assuming no penalty like on KMF leases). Interest rates that credit unions offer are the same as the rates Kia offers, even if slightly higher, they don't add up to the $8000+ incentive you can get.

That is the bottom line: the incentives form the real reason to lease, then the buyout saves having to pay thousands in lease rent on top of it.

 

[CapsCup2018]

I think it's through the dealer

The rent charge is the total interest paid throughout the life of the lease. Divide it by the lease term to see how much of your monthly payment is interest. My big questions for the OP is why did you sign this contract before yo have all your questions about numbers answered?

 

[MerlintheMad]

The rent charge is the total interest paid throughout the life of the lease. Divide it by the lease term to see how much of your monthly payment is interest. My big questions for the OP is why did you sign this contract before yo have all your questions about numbers answered?

Welcome, Caps. It's obvious that anyone new to leasing (like yours truly over a year ago) will never "have all their questions answered" before leasing. Heh, I don't have all my questions answered even now. I know a whole lot more about leasing than I did going in. What the bottom line has to be is: out the door has to be right, add ons have to be explained and denied by me if they are not something I want (this is before the lease is finalized, of course), and the resulting monthly payments have to be in budget. The buyout is a trick made attractive by Kia's big incentive/rebate. I did not even have the term in my vocabulary until I got on this forum almost three months into my lease. That is when I got educated about how to save on the lease rent doing the buyout. I would not lease again, knowing what I do now; other than to take advantage of a big rebate like Kia's.

 

[GenesisG70]

The rent charge is the total interest paid throughout the life of the lease. Divide it by the lease term to see how much of your monthly payment is interest. My big questions for the OP is why did you sign this contract before yo have all your questions about numbers answered?

Cuz passion for the car! Also money not much an issue for me (I know is dumb but is true)