Engine shake - help!

[BAO]

broken motor mount?

Addressed above. Motor doesn't shake at all during standing revs.

 

[BAO]

Is this a 3.3T? Plugging the passenger side (intake manifold) would be a strange choice if so.

It is a 3.3. I guess the plugged hose isn't coming off the actual injen, it's coming from the engine compartment area near the injen. It's the hose that goes to the OCC that is kind of on the engine near the intake. Assume it's done correctly and that my elementary descriptions are elementary.

 

[hummus]

If interested and/or concerned, a picture would probably be most efficient, if possible.

Maybe it doesn't matter though; if you are thinking about switching to a dual can setup and are already troubleshooting, have you already considered just removing the existing can, going back to factory plumbing, and seeing if the vibration problem goes away?

Maintaining factory flow should be much easier with a dual can setup, where each can just goes in-line between manifold-and-PCV, and breather-and-driver side intake.

 

[Kamauxx]

I was hoping for this outcome, which is why I did an alignment immediately after my 20" wheels were put on yesterday. Problem still existed after alignment. It's also a shake only on acceleration, it does away immediately after I let off the throttle.

Alignment is well and good but I'd be more concerned with how well or if at all the wheels/tires were balanced. Hopefully they were, preferably road force balanced. Otherwise your car can do weird things, such as shaking upon acceleration. Not trying to insult your intelligence if these are things you've already done...just something else to consider.

 

[BAO]

Alignment is well and good but I'd be more concerned with how well or if at all the wheels/tires were balanced. Hopefully they were, preferably road force balanced. Otherwise your car can do weird things, such as shaking upon acceleration. Not trying to insult your intelligence if these are things you've already done...just something else to consider.

No offense taken. The shaking occurred before I put the 20s on. I was hoping that the spring sway install I did knocked everything out alignment and caused the shaking, but I took everything to a wheel and alignment shop and they said those looked fine.

 

[nhcowboy28]

Alignment is well and good but I'd be more concerned with how well or if at all the wheels/tires were balanced. Hopefully they were, preferably road force balanced. Otherwise your car can do weird things, such as shaking upon acceleration. Not trying to insult your intelligence if these are things you've already done...just something else to consider.

Absolutely critical to balance the wheels for sure

 

[General_Vodka]

if you think it may be the oil catch can the return it to stock. Should not be that hard.

 

[BAO]

if you think it may be the oil catch can the return it to stock. Should not be that hard.

That's my next step. Right now I'm testing the JB4 on various settings to see if anything like the o2 sensors are causing it, before I remove the JB4 in full. So far, JB4 maps and sensor connections don't appear to be causing the shake.

I did pinpoint the worst part of it, which is when I'm cruising at 45mph or so. When I slowly hit the gas at that speed the pedal / wheel shake is a slow vibration akin to an ABS brake pedal vibration before it vibrates harder / faster until I hit 70ish mph. After 70 it's a normalish mild vibration under acceleration that drops off completely as soon as let off the throttle. The shake also doesn't present itself much (or at all) if I give it throttle at 70mph or 80mph up to greater speeds. The shake does feel like the car is struggling for air, as evidence by a large, normal whoosh sound upon initial throttle press which turns almost immediately into the shake / vibration after.

On a another note, I just want to say how appreciative I am of the users on this forum engaging with me on this. I consider myself a relatively handy person around the house but I am total novice on auto work, and it's really comforting to have a sounding board.

 

[hummus]

Agree with removing that catch can. If it's the culprit, the current problem it's causing far outweighs the potential benefit of having even an correctly functioning one.

Provided the problem goes away when this can is removed or bypassed:
If you have a way to plug one of the inlets, you should also be able to try this can as a single inlet can for testing purposes. If the car continues to run okay and you're confident in the can, you can keep this can and use it as a single-inlet can and purchase another one to add to it; they don't have to be identical parts or even from the same manufacturer. If you go this route, I would put the "better" can on the PCV/passenger side.

 

[nhcowboy28]

On a another note, I just want to say how appreciative I am of the users on this forum engaging with me on this. I consider myself a relatively handy person around the house but I am total novice on auto work, and it's really comforting to have a sounding board.

Everyone was a novice once!

glad you are giving it a shot yourself.

at the end of the day, most of this stuff is nuts and bolts…

 

[BAO]

Update! Problem resolved. Culprit appears to have been the dual inlet catch can check valves failing (and causing some sort of residual issue even though the hoses from the engine were capped off later) AND the struts were out of balance after my lowering springs and sway bars were put on. What a relief.

 

[nhcowboy28]

AND the struts were out of balance…

Wut? Please elaborate.

 

[JSolo]

^^I think he means the struts were cocked.... Car out of alignment¿?

 

[hummus]

Update! Problem resolved. Culprit appears to have been the dual inlet catch can check valves failing (and causing some sort of residual issue even though the hoses from the engine were capped off later) AND the struts were out of balance after my lowering springs and sway bars were put on. What a relief.

Glad that worked out!

I am still perplexed as to where a second check valve would go. I figure one of them was installed between the can and the intake manifold; where was the other? I am still having trouble seeing where another could be of any benefit, again unless you have some special airflow routing that would involve a T junction--and even then, it would probably not be worth the effort and complexity.

If you are interested in running a high quality check valve, UPR sells one that is rate at 0psi cracking pressure and uses a ball to seal instead of a diaphragm/spring. This should be more robust, and is actually serviceable. It's not cheap ($50), but you should only have to buy it once and IMO the peace of mind is well worth it.

 

[BAO]

Wut? Please elaborate.

Again, novice here in skill and communication. But, when the lowering springs and the sway bars were installed, he said that the struts were knocked out of alignment or place or whatever. He fixed that, and it solved some of the problem. The catch can was the other culprit.

 

[BAO]

Glad that worked out!

I am still perplexed as to where a second check valve would go. I figure one of them was installed between the can and the intake manifold; where was the other? I am still having trouble seeing where another could be of any benefit, again unless you have some special airflow routing that would involve a T junction--and even then, it would probably not be worth the effort and complexity.

If you are interested in running a high quality check valve, UPR sells one that is rate at 0psi cracking pressure and uses a ball to seal instead of a diaphragm/spring. This should be more robust, and is actually serviceable. It's not cheap ($50), but you should only have to buy it once and IMO the peace of mind is well worth it.

It was the dual inlet catch can from addw1. The two inlet hoses have check valves on each hose as they approach the can. The check valves itself are like 3 inches from the can. Ie can, 3 inches of hose, check valve, then the main hose lines to the engines or intakes or whatever it is. Both check valves were blown out on initial install and a quick run. Addw1 sent three more check valves and all three of those also failed. They are manufacturing more / better valves but they aren't ready yet. In the meantime, they did right and let me send them back the dual inlet can and sent me the normal dual catch can setup (which doesn't have check valves).

I've got a longer post forthcoming which details everything I did as a first time to mods - what went right, what went wrong, etc.

95% of the problem is gone. I think I can still feel a minor shake on acceleration, but it's basically like normal road vibration. Installer said the injen setup and the jb4 are gonna cause more total vehicle vibration (incremental and moderate as it may be) than running completely stock. So, it runs well and sounds great at this point and I'm pretty happy now.

 

[hummus]

It was the dual inlet catch can from addw1. The two inlet hoses have check valves on each hose as they approach the can. The check valves itself are like 3 inches from the can. Ie can, 3 inches of hose, check valve, then the main hose lines to the engines or intakes or whatever it is. Both check valves were blown out on initial install and a quick run. Addw1 sent three more check valves and all three of those also failed. They are manufacturing more / better valves but they aren't ready yet. In the meantime, they did right and let me send them back the dual inlet can and sent me the normal dual catch can setup (which doesn't have check valves).

I've got a longer post forthcoming which details everything I did as a first time to mods - what went right, what went wrong, etc.

95% of the problem is gone. I think I can still feel a minor shake on acceleration, but it's basically like normal road vibration. Installer said the injen setup and the jb4 are gonna cause more total vehicle vibration (incremental and moderate as it may be) than running completely stock. So, it runs well and sounds great at this point and I'm pretty happy now.

Thanks for clearing it up. Not that it matters if any more if you are no longer using the dual-inlet can, but based on the picture that's forming, I'm thinking that kit is not well designed.

Scenario 1: the second check valve was between the breather port on the driver side of the engine and the catch can. This is bad because that port needs to flow in both directions. A check valve on this side, even when working correctly, would by design block one of those directions, leading to incorrect pressure balance in the crank case.

Scenario 2: the second check valve was between the driver side intake and the catch can, and the breather port was blocked off. In this case, there would be no flow at all through the breather port. When the engine is under boost, the PCV closes, the PCV side check valve closes, crank case pressure builds without a primary means of escape. (Edit: I just saw a picture where the dual inlet can involves a breather filter on the breather port. That is an improvement, but still puzzled on what the second check valve is intended to do.)

I think it's a good thing that the car didn't run correctly with that setup, regardless of whether the check valves were defective or not. That plumbing and check valve setup was inevitably going to be trouble, so thank goodness you got the warning sign early on. No judgement intended, but ideally your installer would have recognized this too.

The fact that the manufacturer makes one kit with the wrong number of check valves (dual inlet) and another with none, assuming that the internals are the same, leaves me questioning their engineering chops. If the dual inlet can would benefit from using a check valve to keep boost out of the can, the same would apply for the PCV can in a dual can setup. If they don't need check valves at all, it made no sense to include one, much less two.

FYI in case you weren't aware, but you can run a check valve on a can that doesn't come with one, and you can leave it out even if it does. If you do run their dual can kit and decide you want to keep boost out of the PCV can, I would be wary of using any check valve of their design, especially if they suggest installing two valves. To repeat: a check valve has no place on the breather side, and the PCV side does not need more than one, flowing in the correct orientation.

Personally, if the choice was between running a questionable check valve or none at all, I'd go with the latter. Even if it doesn't stick or blow, a poor valve could conceivably leak or restrict flow unintentionally. Too many risks, IMO.

You don't need to take my word for that though, as there's plenty of reading and viewing material out there on this topic.

I do hope it all works out, and it does sound like you're getting back on track.

 

[DoctorStiches]

Oh boy...
Shake very similar currently occurring after lowering my car.
My occ has been on for 40k miles.
Lowering is the only new thing.
Wide wheels new tires fresh alignment....

Can someone please elaborate in plain english how my shocks could be 'out of alignment ' that whole concept is new to me....

 

[BAO]

Oh boy...
Shake very similar currently occurring after lowering my car.
My occ has been on for 40k miles.
Lowering is the only new thing.
Wide wheels new tires fresh alignment....

Can someone please elaborate in plain english how my shocks could be 'out of alignment ' that whole concept is new to me....

Not sure. While my problem has mostly resolved itself, it does still occur infrequently. I have been told by a few people that it could be the lowering springs in some way, although two independent shops and a dealer have looked at them and said they look fine.

I'm on Ark GTF springs in case that aligns with your issue.

Oh boy...
Shake very similar currently occurring after lowering my car.
My occ has been on for 40k miles.
Lowering is the only new thing.
Wide wheels new tires fresh alignment....

Can someone please elaborate in plain english how my shocks could be 'out of alignment ' that whole concept is new to me....

Not sure. While my problem has mostly resolved itself, it does still occur infrequently. I have been told by a few people that it could be the lowering springs in some way, although two independent shops and a dealer have looked at them and said they look fine.

I'm on Ark GTF springs in case that aligns with your issue.

 

[DoctorStiches]

Not sure. While my problem has mostly resolved itself, it does still occur infrequently. I have been told by a few people that it could be the lowering springs in some way, although two independent shops and a dealer have looked at them and said they look fine.

I'm on Ark GTF springs in case that aligns with your issue.

Not sure. While my problem has mostly resolved itself, it does still occur infrequently. I have been told by a few people that it could be the lowering springs in some way, although two independent shops and a dealer have looked at them and said they look fine.

I'm on Ark GTF springs in case that aligns with your issue.

Ark-gtf aswell....
Hmmmm
One post on a g90 forum said

""I figured this out with the guys on another forum. It was the axle, it dropped the rollers out of the tri pod bearings, when I extended axle out of the cv cup to get the angle I needed to remove the strut""

So im personaly talking to my mechanic about the amount of work it takes to fix this...