BMW owner ogling my Stinger

[AnalogMan]

Today parked in Freeport Maine, next to a BMW X5, I came out to the car and found the guys in the BMW were checking out my Stinger. One of them was all excited, saying 'Nice car!' and 'Stinger, who makes that car? Who builds it?'. When I said Kia, his face got contorted in a mixture of amusement, bewilderment, disbelief, and astonishment, and he squeaked, "Kia?!?!"

As has been pointed out and discussed many times before, this has been the Stinger's primary (and maybe only) problem: it's built by Kia. The specifications, build quality, and performance of the car just don't match the perception of Kia. I think they would have sold many more of these cars if it wasn't given to Kia dealers (the sleaziness of most Kia dealers didn't help either).

To be honest, that was one of the strong attractions for me to this car. It's the anti-snob car. So many people buy a car just for the brag value of being able to show off to strangers about their Beemer, Benz, or Por-shuh. Like one of my friends, who always buys the highest number series BMW he can afford (5, 7, etc.), just to show off and be able to say he drives a '5 series'. It usually means they're high-mileage, unreliable, and expensive to maintain, but major brag value.

The Stinger is the opposite of that. No one buys this car to brag at the bar about 'scoring a Kia'. You only buy the car if you care about what it actually is, the design, the engineering, the performance, the build quality, and the value it is for the money. The car has similar (if not better) specs to a 5 or 6 series BMW for tens of thousands of dollars less purchase price, and far better reliability and less expensive maintenance and repair costs. That spoke loudly and clearly to me.

Hyundai created an entirely new division, Genesis, to sell their 'premium' cars. I imagine the Stinger would have sold much better if it were branded a 'Genesis'. The only downside is, selling so few of them, the rumors of its demise may well be true.

 

[app_master]

Good summary man. I still believe the Stinger has created "some" brand awareness for Kia. It will become known as a milestone car for the brand in the coming years after it ends (if?). I just wish they went the whole damn hog and did a full blown supercar halo version, like the GT-R is to Nissan, for a true cult car status/beginning. Before the electric car fully ushers in our new car future. Still glad I have one. It's a gem, I will hold onto for while.

 

[nhcowboy28]

Careful.
You let those beemah guys look at your ride too long, and the turn signals will stop working on your car.

 

[MerlintheMad]

As has been pointed out and discussed many times before, this has been the Stinger's primary (and maybe only) problem: it's built by Kia. ... The only downside is, selling so few of them, the rumors of its demise may well be true.

The reason why Kia produces the Stinger is to use shock and awe: this is a good thing. And as for low sales, it's not as if someone who specifically wants a Stinger is going to settle for a K5 or want an SUV. How many ambivalent buyers walked into Kia looking for a Kia to buy? Over 50K Stingers have sold brand new so far in the US: that's money Kia would never have made if they had not come up with the Stinger.

 

[AnalogMan]

The reason why Kia produces the Stinger is to use shock and awe: this is a good thing. And as for low sales, it's not as if someone who specifically wants a Stinger is going to settle for a K5 or want an SUV. How many ambivalent buyers walked into Kia looking for a Kia to buy? Over 50K Stingers have sold brand new so far in the US: that's money Kia would never have made if they had not come up with the Stinger.

'Shock and awe' only matters to a company if it results in sales. Even 'halo cars' only count to them if they measurably increase the sales of other models. It's the bottom line - all companies are driven by profits and nothing else. I don't know how many (if any) people were drawn into Kia showrooms to look at a Stinger and instead drove out in something else. Other than a physical resemblance to the latest Optima, the Stinger doesn't seem to share much of its DNA with other Kia offerings (but then, maybe the resemblance to the Optima is all that was needed?).

Enthusiast gearheads (by definition, anyone on this forum) know about the Kia. But judging from how many other gawkers I've encountered in the week and a half since I bought the car (many, and several in BMW's), and how many other Stingers I've seen on the road in that time (exactly none), I suspect the awareness has been limited only to those in the know already who are car people and seek out information and novelty (again, like all of us here).

I don't care one way or another about seeing myself driving down the road. But if Kia has only sold a total of about 50,000 Stingers in 5 model years, that's not even rounding error for them. I don't know what their hurdle was for minimum volume to justify the Stinger investment, but I suspect it was something greater than what they've sold so far.

Again I don't care one way or another, and in some ways the rarity is kind of nice and might make the Stinger 'collectible' someday (probably long after I've sold mine, like has happened with every other currently collectible car I've owned oveh the past 47 years that were merely 'used cars' back in the day). My hope would be for Kia to be sufficiently satisfied with the money they make on the Kia to keep building it in case I'd like to buy another one.

But that might be a moot point anyway. The future is soulless, joyless electric appliance transportation modules. We should all appreciate and enjoy passionate, fun cars like the Stinger now, because it's getting to be 'last call' for internal combustion.

 

[MerlintheMad]

'Shock and awe' only matters to a company if it results in sales. Even 'halo cars' only count to them if they measurably increase the sales of other models.

Any difference of opinion here would hinge on "how much is the Stinger influencing Kia sales"? How much influence do car enthusiasts have on general sales? We all know that the Stinger, just sitting there, is an attention getter. YTD is only down -6% compared to 2019 (the Soul appears to be tanking at -30%: the new, post-Stinger models are both up: K5 already higher YTD than the erstwhile Optima; Telluride up 96%): I think that the Stinger both sells itself (to car enthusiasts and guys in midlife crisis , often the same people) and these newer models, by being visible.

 

[AnalogMan]

I think that the Stinger both sells itself (to car enthusiasts and guys in midlife crisis , often the same people) and these newer models, by being visible.

You're absolutely right. The Stinger does sell itself, to people in the know - gearheads and aging enthusiasts (and yes, you're right again about car enthusiasts and guys in midlife crisis often being one and the same)(though unfortunately I'm well past the 'mid' life part and am now an 'aging' enthusiast). It's the perfect car for enthusiasts getting on in years!

I don't know how much enthusiasts and halo cars influence general car sales anymore. It was a classic marketing concept in the 1960's - guys come in to ogle a Mustang, Cobra, or GT40 and drive out in a Torino (or something else with the perception of having a little bit of the DNA of the car they really wanted, in a more practical package).

For years the market for either true sports cars, or even 'sporty' cars (hot hatchbacks, etc.) has been shrinking. More and more people have been buying SUVs and their shrunken equivalent CUV's. Plus a segment of the market that's been going to 'green' cars, pure electric or hybrid, which don't lend themselves to enthusiast-oriented fun cars (the abomination of the Ford Mach-E "Mustang" notwithstanding).

I came of age (automotive and otherwise) in the 1960's, loving cars of that time and the 50's. Fun to drive 'enthusiast' cars speak to me. My 'practical' daily driver until the Stinger purchase last week was a Subaru WRX (I might have been one of the oldest WRX owners on record). My other cars are a BRZ and Mustang GT (both with manual transmissions). But I'm a vanishing, dying breed. Even most of my peers who once were also enthusiasts have long since moved to SUV/CUV trucklets, or been browbeaten into electric cars. I still want a car that's just pure fun to drive.

I don't care about the 'numbers', 0-60, Nurburgring lap times, 1/4 mile, etc. because I don't spend much time on the Nurburgring or ripping off 0-60 or 1/4 mile runs at every stop light. I drive on public roads and care about how a car feels to the seat of my pants, if I feel a connection with the road, not about 0-60 time bragging rights to strangers at a bar. The BRZ doesn't have impressive 'numbers' but man is it a blast to just drive.

The Stinger has both. The 'numbers' are astonishingly impressive for the price, but much more importantly (especially to my aging bones), it captures that elusive combination of being fun to drive, outstanding performance, but also comfortable enough to take on long drives, and practical enough to be a daily driver (as well as reliable and reasonable to maintain). It's an awfully short list of cars (IMHO) that meet all those criteria.

I hope the Stinger has a long and lucrative for Kia (necessary for it to have a future), both selfishly if I ever want to buy another one, and just because I think the world is a more interesting, colorful place with fun-to-drive soulful cars in it (rather than being slowly zombiefied by soulless, charmless, characterless, joyless, austere electric appliances). Major kudos to Subaru and Toyota for building a next-generation BRZ, and to Nissan for revising the Z car. But I don't see any sales trends back to sporty cars, only more and more manufacturers jumping on the SUV/CUV/electric car bandwagons.

And the world will be a more boring place as a result.

 

[Kamauxx]

One of them was all excited, saying 'Nice car!' and 'Stinger, who makes that car? Who builds it?'. When I said Kia, his face got contorted in a mixture of amusement, bewilderment, disbelief, and astonishment, and he squeaked, "Kia?!?!"

Six model years in and this is still a thing?! The Stinger's marketing people should all be fired!

 

[Robilar]

I think the K5 will benefit from the Stinger more than anything. If the Stinger draws the customers into a Kia showroom, the K5's more reasonable price point and still sharp looks will get them to buy.

My quibbles about the Stinger have largely been addressed with the 2022, bigger better infotainment screen, better sounding exhaust, blind spot cameras, nice rims etc.

I've honestly been halfway tempted to trade my recently acquired low mileage 2019 in for a new 2022 but now that I've modded my car so much I've kind of changed my mind.

 

[Robilar]

Six model years in and this is still a thing?! The Stinger's marketing people should all be fired!

It came out for 2018, 6 years?

 

[Kamauxx]

It came out for 2018, 6 years?

First model year was 2017.

2018 is when it arrived in North America.

17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22 = 6 model years.

 

[Robilar]

First model year was 2017.

2018 is when it arrived in North America.

17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22 = 6 model years.

Fair enough, I was thinking North America

 

[YEH]

Hyundai created an entirely new division, Genesis, to sell their 'premium' cars. I imagine the Stinger would have sold much better if it were branded a 'Genesis'. The only downside is, selling so few of them, the rumors of its demise may well be true.

The Stinger has pretty much always outsold the G70 here (due to some of the fundamental flaws of the G70).

Liftbacks are a niche bodystyle - the 4 Series GC, A5 Sportback and especially the Arteon don't sell in any large volumes here either.

Kia has no problem moving the Telluride and now the Carnival at the $40k+ price-point.

 

[app_master]

The Stinger has pretty much always outsold the G70 here (due to some of the fundamental flaws of the G70).

Liftbacks are a niche bodystyle - the 4 Series GC, A5 Sportback and especially the Arteon don't sell in any large volumes here either.

Kia has no problem moving the Telluride and now the Carnival at the $40k+ price-point.

True $40k+ Kia's are not the problem, it is the segment (mid-large sedans) the Stinger is in that continues to shrink. Sad facts right. Manufactures are here to make money. Leaves us all with a somewhat unique car (if it has no successor) and has modern classic written all over it. Another decade or so should prove me right and if I can afford to, and also garage it, I'll be keeping mine.

 

[NS_Stinger]

But that might be a moot point anyway. The future is soulless, joyless electric appliance transportation modules. We should all appreciate and enjoy passionate, fun cars like the Stinger now, because it's getting to be 'last call' for internal combustion.

I couldn't agree with you more. Don't get me wrong the acceleration times that these electric cars are putting down are insane. But EV's are even beginning to make acceleration numbers a moot point. Does 0-60 even matter anymore when you have easily assessible electric cars that run 1 second and low 2 second 0-60's and can destroy and hang with hypercars? The self-driving thing is just the tip of the iceberg too, eventually insurance companies will be pushing the self-driving tech with big discounts and you won't even be able to control the cars anymore other than punching in your destination. I know that's still probably quite a long ways off but the fact that it will probably happen is sad. Combustion cars will eventually be collectable and sought after not for their performance numbers but for their nostalgia.

 

[Dan12R]

To the OP's point, I'm reminded of an old saying. Whenever you think "I never see blue cars on the road" and then you buy a blue car, that's suddenly all you see. I've had my Stinger for less than a week and that's been far from the case. Had I purchased any of the other cars that I considered, that wouldn't have been the case. I'm constantly asked "What is that?"

It kind of feels like I found this rare gem that nobody else even considered. The car is priced alongside BMW's and Audis but who of their typical clientele is going to take a look at Kia? Unless they know cars and pay attention to the whole landscape, they're going to overlook this one.

It kind of reminds me of the days when I carried a Windows Phone. It was quite rare and caused people to stop and ask "What is that?"

 

[stoopid]

Liftbacks are a niche bodystyle - the 4 Series GC, A5 Sportback and especially the Arteon don't sell in any large volumes here either.

Fun fact: most people I show my car to don't even realize it's a hatchback. They're all wowed when I open the 'trunk'. lol

The car not selling isn't a product of styling, it's an eye catcher. The fact people don't know it's a Kia isn't entirely Kia's fault, the car was well distributed to all the car magazines and youtubers. BMWs are, for the most part, status symbol purchases. Many (most?) BMW/Audi owners would be fine driving a Corolla from a driving experience perspective. And they still wouldn't use a turn signal, you just need to step aside bro.

So what I'm saying is, and a reason this forum is for the most part full over genuinely interested car owners/enthusiasts, is that you need to be INTO cars to appreciate what the Stinger is. Driving a status symbol implies you know nothing about the car from a mechanical or performance perspective. Many (most?) Lexus owners probably fall into this category car owner as well.

 

[Dan12R]

Fun fact: most people I show my car to don't even realize it's a hatchback. They're all wowed when I open the 'trunk'. lol

The car not selling isn't a product of styling, it's an eye catcher. The fact people don't know it's a Kia isn't entirely Kia's fault, the car was well distributed to all the car magazines and youtubers. BMWs are, for the most part, status symbol purchases. Many (most?) BMW/Audi owners would be fine driving a Corolla from a driving experience perspective. And they still wouldn't use a turn signal, you just need to step aside bro.

So what I'm saying is, and a reason this forum is for the most part full over genuinely interested car owners/enthusiasts, is that you need to be INTO cars to appreciate what the Stinger is. Driving a status symbol implies you know nothing about the car from a mechanical or performance perspective. Many (most?) Lexus owners probably fall into this category car owner as well.

Definitely some truth here. To many, a car is an appliance much like a dish washer. They just want it to do a job. For those looking for their appliance to also be a status symbol, they're not going to look at Kia. A Kia isn't a status symbol.

The Stinger is an enthusiast's car. I guess in its own way, that makes it a status symbol. It's just a different type of symbol. If I see someone driving a Stinger, I'm going to think that that's somebody who did their homework, someone who appreciates driving. I can't really say that, when I see someone with a BMW, even a BMW M3. Maybe they bought it because they enjoy driving but they may have also bought it so they could say they drive a fancy BMW.

An example is that my sister drives an Audi and it's primarily to declare a status. She would never look at the Kia alternative to what she drives, the Telluride, because she doesn't think that will command the same respect as an Audi. I had people tell me that I should get a BMW instead of the Stinger because "What's a girl going to think when you tell her you drive a Kia? She's not going to know what a Stinger is or that Kia poached people from BMW to design it."

Sadly, the enthusiast driver crowd is a dying breed. There's a reason the manual transmission is going away. Yes, dual clutch systems can outperform a manual but it's also because fewer people enjoy driving. Looking at the numbers on when people get their driver's license, the average age is getting older and older because kids don't feel as inclined to learn to drive as they did in the past. They just don't have that passion. I could go on and on as to why that's happening but it's a lengthy discussion. The main takeaway is that I imagine that as time rolls on, we'll see fewer and fewer enthusiast vehicles like the Stinger. And that's a real shame.

 

[Robilar]

Fun fact: most people I show my car to don't even realize it's a hatchback. They're all wowed when I open the 'trunk'. lol

The car not selling isn't a product of styling, it's an eye catcher. The fact people don't know it's a Kia isn't entirely Kia's fault, the car was well distributed to all the car magazines and youtubers. BMWs are, for the most part, status symbol purchases. Many (most?) BMW/Audi owners would be fine driving a Corolla from a driving experience perspective. And they still wouldn't use a turn signal, you just need to step aside bro.

So what I'm saying is, and a reason this forum is for the most part full over genuinely interested car owners/enthusiasts, is that you need to be INTO cars to appreciate what the Stinger is. Driving a status symbol implies you know nothing about the car from a mechanical or performance perspective. Many (most?) Lexus owners probably fall into this category car owner as well.

One of the main reasons I bought the Stinger was because it has a power hatchback. I came from an SUV and this thing is pretty much as useful except perhaps when buying huge items.

 

[GenesisG70]

I bought my stinger to brag its a Kia yes you heard it this Kia's halo so what's wrong with bragging it's it's Kia? Stupid people forget Hundia/kia are the 5th car maker on the plantet.... people need to stop living in 1980. I have had way more problems and headaches with German and American cars than with my Korean cars I have owned.