Proper 12v, Accessory, and Ignition wires

[Berzerker]

I provided you a valid method for doing things because you asked and immediately began to tear down what I said even though I said it wasn't mean to be a comprehensive analysis. You can't ignore your responses and then you continued to go down a rabbit hole. You asked how "certified installers" do it and I told you. You then replied with something else. We have fundamentally different ways of doing things and that's fine, but to try to categorize what I said as "wrong" is just invalid. My credentials are what gives me the ability to speak with confidence about these types of systems. I understand if that's not what you wanted to hear at the time but it doesn't take away from the fact. This isn't the place to try to give a clinic on vehicle electronics and at the core, I believe that is something that we both can agree to.

I never asked about that. I asked why it was *bad*, from a harm perspective. I wasn't interested in the way the installers did it, I was asking for your explanation on why it would be bad.

I never claimed the way you said installers did it was wrong, I was pointing out flaws in what you were saying and how they didn't work with how physics and electricity works. I never insulted any work that you've done, I was trying to correct mistakes in ideology that could confuse people reading here. I've also tried to explain, subtly, that credentials don't always mean much. I work with plenty of "credentialed" people that don't know their ass out of a tin can, so I tend to be very skeptical when people throw certifications in my face. I understand that's probably not what *you* want to here, but my facts are still facts as well.

I agree that this thread needs cleaning up, but I disagree on cherry picking which posts should be removed. This entire thread needs to be purged.

 

[ecko04]

I never asked about that. I asked why it was *bad*, from a harm perspective. I wasn't interested in the way the installers did it, I was asking for your explanation on why it would be bad.

I never claimed the way you said installers did it was wrong, I was pointing out flaws in what you were saying and how they didn't work with how physics and electricity works. I never insulted any work that you've done, I was trying to correct mistakes in ideology that could confuse people reading here. I've also tried to explain, subtly, that credentials don't always mean much. I work with plenty of "credentialed" people that don't know their ass out of a tin can, so I tend to be very skeptical when people throw certifications in my face. I understand that's probably not what *you* want to here, but my facts are still facts as well.

I agree that this thread needs cleaning up, but I disagree on cherry picking which posts should be removed. This entire thread needs to be purged.

There’s nothing wrong with this thread. The only problem is you took issue when I said that adding a fuse to a fuse block isn’t how installers do things and why there are issues with it. Despite the fact that someone else chimed in and disagreed with your post you continued down that road. But really the only issue occurred when you asked for clarification and disagreed. There was nothing wrong with this thread before that point and therefore purging it makes no sense.

 

[Berzerker]

There’s nothing wrong with this thread. The only problem is you took issue when I said that adding a fuse to a fuse block isn’t how installers do things and why there are issues with it. Despite the fact that someone else chimed in and disagreed with your post you continued down that road. But really the only issue occurred when you asked for clarification and disagreed. There was nothing wrong with this thread before that point and therefore purging it makes no sense.

There's quite a bit wrong with it...but anyway:

This is exactly your quote (before anyone, including me, claimed anything anyone said was wrong):

I won’t even begin to go into why you don’t want to add fuses to a fuse box where the fuse wasn’t originally there and make assumptions for what amperage that unused circuit can reliably hold.

I took issue with you being condescending and continuing to post incorrect information, nothing against you as an installer or what installers do. No one else disagreed with me, only one person rated it that way to jump on the bandwagon because you have a certification and was seemingly afraid to comment. I wholeheartedly welcome anyone to come here and discuss, but just voting and moving on doesn't prove or help anything.

If this thread stays up, I'll still have issue with the information provided and nothing will be solved.

 

[ecko04]

I’m just going to ignore that user and move on. Pointless to continue down this road.

 

[Berzerker]

I’m just going to ignore that user and move on. Pointless to continue down this road.

Just like you're ignoring all of the facts I'm presenting.

If you continue to post incorrect info, I'm going to point it out, regardless if you want to respond or not.

 

[namja]

I regret watching this thread lol.

 

[Ozstung]

No quarter given no quarter taken, EPIC!

 

[ecko04]

I regret watching this thread lol.

As do I. Should’ve never engaged with that person to begin with.

But the ignore button works miracles.

 

[Berzerker]

As do I. Should’ve never engaged with that person to begin with.

But the ignore button works miracles.

You should have never tried to argue something you seemingly know little about, but here we are.
Ignore me all you want, but I’ll still take pride in correcting your mistakes.

 

[LA-Stinger213]

this was too funny to read

 

[MacDogg]

this was too funny to read

and I still don't know if I should put a fuse in an unused slot for dual dash cams.

 

[LA-Stinger213]

funny to read this this but ecko is right. as an installer myself, not MECP Master though but I am Advanced, what he said is exactly how we do things when we install remote starts and alarms. i have put in enough radios, dash cams, radar detectors, and monitors out here in the bay to know we do not add fuses to empty spots. what he said about adding a fuse to a empty space is right if you do not know the source or anything else that may be connected to ...who knows what it may be intented to power. ecko was trying to make this point and it probably was not as clear as it could have been but after all this is the internet. I think the berzerker is from a different field and maybe it is something they do often but from a car audio install perspective ecko is right. If the argument is purely about electricity in general and not related to an automotive 12v system or scoped as that then carry on.

 

[LA-Stinger213]

another thing ecko didnt say but for my company when we do installs we dont have a entire vehicle schematic. we have limited access to something like directechs or any of the other resources except for alldata we have wiring diagrams for specific areas needed to perform the install we are doing. while installing aftermarket equipment does pull current from wherever we tap it is capable of the draw based on the information we have. maybe if we had an entire schema then I would feel more comfortable adding a fuse to an empty location instead of tapping the existing wiring but thats just me. i personally dont think wither one of them is wrong they just do things differently. my company does things like ecko mentions though.

 

[Berzerker]

funny to read this this but ecko is right. as an installer myself, not MECP Master though but I am Advanced, what he said is exactly how we do things when we install remote starts and alarms. i have put in enough radios, dash cams, radar detectors, and monitors out here in the bay to know we do not add fuses to empty spots. what he said about adding a fuse to a empty space is right if you do not know the source or anything else that may be connected to ...who knows what it may be intented to power. ecko was trying to make this point and it probably was not as clear as it could have been but after all this is the internet. I think the berzerker is from a different field and maybe it is something they do often but from a car audio install perspective ecko is right. If the argument is purely about electricity in general and not related to an automotive 12v system or scoped as that then carry on.

Yeah I never brought up anything on how installers do anything or insulted anyone for their actual work. This was purely me pointing out glaring issues with fundamentals and a general lack of understanding of how physics works. That’s all.

I thought my posts made that quite clear.

 

[LA-Stinger213]

i dnt want to get into the physics of things. I just think what happened was very unfortunate. just reading it all go down was insane. i didnt see anything wrong with ecko mentioned from an install perspective and i thought he said that it wasnt meant to be complete. i think you were trying to provide a complete picture from what he left out. then it just went sideways from there for no good reason and even further down the toilet with rude messages from both of you. when its in reference to a car it seemed to align with what was said but i am no expert on physics. wiring is something i know pretty well tho. it took a well meaning thread and changed to something very different and confused more people.

 

[namja]

Yeah so this definitely deters me from ever installing devices myself directly into the fuse box (at least with the Stinger) and going with a pro installer that offers warranty.

 

[Berzerker]

Yeah so this definitely deters me from ever installing devices myself directly into the fuse box (at least with the Stinger) and going with a pro installer that offers warranty.

I'm not really sure why. I think a lot installers you talk to will have these situations conflated with installs where taps are required. Things like remote start, light addons, etc, require electrical taps because they need access to the existing electrical system, i.e. when things turn on, when they turn off, when a signal is sent, intercepting a signal, etc. For those, I absolutely agree that you should take them to a pro/certified installer.

For something like installing a dashcam or a radar detector, where no other access to the electrical system is required, installing into an empty fuse, or tapping an existing fuse with an adapter is undoubtably a safer option, since you're not cutting or jamming wires anywhere that isn't expected.

 

[turboAWD]

Yeah so this definitely deters me from ever installing devices myself directly into the fuse box (at least with the Stinger) and going with a pro installer that offers warranty.

There are actually a couple of slots labeled "auxiliary" or "spare" on my fuse box panel. Pretty sure those are relatively safe to use for a low-power application like the ECS10..

 

[LA-Stinger213]

it will probably work fine and have no issues. But if the standard is what a certified mobile electronics installer would do it is what ecko and I have mentioned. i would use an in-line fuse at a lower amperage than the source. if I were to go with the ignition, the ignition circuit is usually fused anywhere between 20 to 25 amps and a few times I have seen 30 amps so I have no issue using a 5 or 10 amp in-line fuse to a dashcam or another peripheral and that makes troubleshooting easy later on down the line if theres a case of parasitic drain.

not saying that adding a fuse wldnt work but its just not the approach i would take. from my experience i think the "spare" on the fuse panel isnt actually powered. it is there to hold a fuse in case one of the same amperage blows you have one to replace it with. but maybe in the stinger it is different. i havent dug into mine to meter for power.

 

[djerickd]

Is there a guide to the fuse box and wires under the hood?