Manual Mode Shifting Points?

[Sickicks]

Hey guys, Another few noob questions. So recently i used manual mode, i have a jb4 map 1 and intakes. Its fun but when i hear other people on the forum or see them on youtube shifting they say the best shift point is 5-6k rpm. My question is how the hell are you guys hitting that rpm without stopping bc of fear that you may break something. Ive shifted in 1st at 4k maybe 5 but i really have to jam my foot on the throttle hard like pedal to medal, if im jjust crusing and wanna build some boost and try to do that i pretty much shit my self from hearing the engine sound so strained past like 3.2k rpm. Am i just being too cautious with it, or are the people saykng 5-6k rpm best shift points specifically talking about when your trying to really zip around.

Also noticed that if i let it auto shift in sportsmode, its shifting pretty early if like im going 48 and its in 5th, and then if i drop down to 30mph its still in 5th but will down shift once i really brake. Is this normal? Late to downshift early to upshift moreso late tk down though.

Tdldr, Is 5-6k rpm the shift point your using for semi aggressive driving and agressive driving or just aggressive. Do u find sports more is very delayed at down shifting and slightly early at upshifting?

 

[Alpinesting]

Drive Safe

 

[Thomby]

Ive shifted in 1st at 4k maybe 5 but i really have to jam my foot on the throttle hard like pedal to medal, if im jjust crusing and wanna build some boost and try to do that i pretty much shit my self from hearing the engine sound so strained past like 3.2k rpm

Your car should run fine all the way out to the 6500 rpm redline, although some people trying to get the best possible 0-60 or 1/4 mile times short shift at 5900ish due to the power dropoff above 6000. Day to day I laze around town at 1000-2000 rpm, and the turbos kick in so low that WOT from 2-3000 rpm may be plenty to shove you into your seat and pass someone, but your engine should not be "strained" above that.

If you want to take a video we can listen and see if something sounds off (and you could try to pull ODBII codes to see if anything's running incorrectly).

Also noticed that if i let it auto shift in sportsmode, its shifting pretty early if like im going 48 and its in 5th, and then if i drop down to 30mph its still in 5th but will down shift once i really brake. Is this normal? Late to downshift early to upshift moreso late tk down though.

Sport mode will raise your upshift points, and hold lower gears longer. Typically if I'm cruising in Eco/Comfort, my revs will be low enough that flipping to Sport will trigger a downshift/uprev with no change in throttle input. I believe Sport also locks out 8th gear (I think you can manually upshift to it though).

Manual shifting in non-Sport will hold the gear you pick for a bit and then revert to auto, and manual shifting in Sport will hold gears within reason, but if you brake to a stop in high gear it's not going to stall the engine like a manual. It also won't let you "moneyshift" (upshift to too low a gear, forcing the engine above redline).

 

[Snicklefritz]

I use the paddle shifters 99% of the time, and have done so for most of seven years. So I can speak to this. Wide open throttle WOT is the only time that you will realistically ever see 6000 plus RPM and only for as long as it takes to upshift. It matters not if you refuse or fail to shift when the car "thinks" that you should, it will take over and upshift for you. So, even when using paddles, if you WOT just let the car do it all for the duration of the acceleration, it will probably do it anyway because it thinks your stupid. Ha hah.

I rarely use Sport, as shifting for myself kind of makes Sport mode redundant. I shift when I choose.

You cannot possibly damage the engine by revving to red line. Even if you could hold the revs at 6500 nothing would happen unless that particular engine had a flaw, and your 100K miles powertrain warranty would cover it anyway. Red line is well within the safety zone for these engines. KIA, actually all Hyundai products, rev/stress test the beans out of these engines, running them at red line for over 12 days only stopping to change the oil. Then they add ten to twenty percent more revs for another ten to twenty hours. No way can we duplicate that.

I would be more concerned about cold starting and running off at WOT or similar before the engine is up to operating temperature.

 

[BIG-D]

Revving the stock turbos out to redline 6300+ just heats the turbo air up quicker.

Especially if you have stock dump pipes and all cats in place.

Short shifting at 5200 -5500 etc gives quicker dragy times and for that reason i only seem to manually paddle shift these days if in the need for a fast get away.

If i was to buy an ecu tune i would purposely have the redline lowered to 5500rpm!

 

[Thomby]

Short shifting at 5200 -5500 etc gives quicker dragy times and for that reason i only seem to manually paddle shift these days if in the need for a fast get away.

If i was to buy an ecu tune i would purposely have the redline lowered to 5500rpm!

I thought the fastest times were more like 58-5900. If you shift at 5500 you'll drop to ~3500 rpm in 2nd/3rd, 4000 in 4th, 4500 in 5th, so you won't be straddling peak power and maximizing area under the curve. At 6000 you'll be dropping to 4000, 4500, 5000, which I think will capture the most power.

Here's a table I made (verified against rpm/mph in logs and knowing 80mph in 8th is ~2100 rpm). So you rev down the chart then shift over a column to the matching speed to find rpm where the next gear will engage. Red is for shifts at 6500, orange for shifts at 6000, yellow at 5500:



Edit: it did not like my pasted table so had to replace with an image (for anyone trying to replicate, you can get mph values using: RPM / gear ratio / final drive * tire * 3.1415 / 12 / 5280 * 60)

 

[BIG-D]

And ???

 

[BIG-D]

Re read my post genius...

 

[Thomby]

Re read my post genius...

I'm not disputing that revving all the way to the 6500 rpm redline isn't ideal, because torque falls off steeply enough by then that you're making less power than at the revs where the next gear engages.

But if you shift as early as 5200, you're giving up an extra 500 rpm at basically peak power (flat purple line), for time in the 3300-3700 range (increasing purple line). How can that be faster?