Dealer and Buying issues

[orlando_dad_bod]

I have been wanting a Kia Stinger since it was announced. I have been a Kia owner for 10 years now. I have bought all my vehicles (4) from the same dealership and same sales rep. The Stinger came out and they just won't work with me on getting me into a Stinger! I currently am 2 years into my 4 year lease on my 2015 Cadenza Premium, perfect condition with only 30k miles on it. Am I crazy, or am I asking too much when I want to trade in my current lease to lease the Stinger? Is $500 a month for a GT base too much to ask (currently $400/month and the Cazdenza was stickered at 42k, paid 34k)? My guy tells me I would need to put $14k down to get my payment there! Please help, just seems like the dealers in my area (Orlando, FL) aren't negotiating anything for the Stingers right now. Or maybe I am crazy and asking to much (or for too little I guess). Another thing, I am noticing some shady pricing. GT1 online listed for 49k, go to dealership and its stickered at 43k because they added a pin stripe to it. SMH. I am not a patient person and want a Stinger now.

 

[Luminary]

You sound much like me. I have owned a KIA of one kind or another since 2005. 6 KIA's prior to the Stinger, and from the same dealership over the years. If you tend to be loyal like me, maybe it is time to break that trend and look at other dealerships and see what they can offer you instead.

 

[orlando_dad_bod]

You sound much like me. I have owned a KIA of one kind or another since 2005. 6 KIA's prior to the Stinger, and from the same dealership over the years. If you tend to be loyal like me, maybe it is time to break that trend and look at other dealerships and see what they can offer you instead.

I tried one other dealership and they told me "they really wanted my business". But still were asking for a lot. And one of the ones they had for "43k", they take me to see it and its 49,900. I was like are you kidding me? I am just really frustrated as I am slightly obsessed with the Stinger and just can not get it done. I don't want to throw money away (married, family, bills, etc.) and I don't want to wait two years for my current lease to be up. Longer I wait, more miles I put on my car, hurting my chances even more. Again, I feel like I am talking crazy, but Kia obviously doesn't care if they get these cars on the road or not.

 

[iclicku]

Kia cares this dealer doesn't.

 

[Dave Miller]

Marking their cars up $4k+ is one thing, but getting you out of a lease 2 years early is a completely different task and a bit of a roadblock. It really depends on how your Cadenza has held up to its residual value. If your trade-in value is anywhere near what the lease buyout would be, you may be able to get out of your lease early, but that's usually unlikely. Especially with a car that depreciates quickly like the Cadenza, and extra especially if you brought over any negative equity onto your current lease.

$14k sounds pretty high, but with 2 years left on your current lease you're likely going to need some money to get out of your lease early. Trust me, I feel you. I have 2.5 left on my lease before I can finally get a Stinger into my hands.. I'm debating on making double payments to shorten it down to a little over a year.

 

[davewg]

What's a 2 year old Cadenza worth with 30k miles on it? And don't point to the residual, because that's what the leasing company says its worth at the end of the lease.

You're in a situation where you still owe 2 years of payments to get out of the lease even on a trade. So that gets factored into your deal. The reality is, you're looking at something like remaining lease payments + cost of the Stinger.

If the dealer takes it in trade they have to pay off the lease (or you do), then pay the residual before they can sell it.

I think you're never going to see the deal you want without putting $ into it.

 

[Clearly Canadian]

Marking their cars up $4k+ is one thing, but getting you out of a lease 2 years early is a completely different task and a bit of a roadblock. It really depends on how your Cadenza has held up to its residual value. If your trade-in value is anywhere near what the lease buyout would be, you may be able to get out of your lease early, but that's usually unlikely. Especially with a car that depreciates quickly like the Cadenza, and extra especially if you brought over any negative equity onto your current lease.

$14k sounds pretty high, but with 2 years left on your current lease you're likely going to need some money to get out of your lease early. Trust me, I feel you. I have 2.5 left on my lease before I can finally get a Stinger into my hands.. I'm debating on making double payments to shorten it down to a little over a year.

What is your opinion in regards to depreciation of the Stinger?

 

[Dave Miller]

What is your opinion in regards to depreciation of the Stinger?

It's hard to tell. I wish I had a crystal ball to tell you the real answer

It's honestly a toss-up. If it follows the path of the Cadenza and K900, it will not hold its value well. But this isn't the Cadenza or K900, this is a complete game changer and a dream car. I think the only way to know how it will hold its value is to let time tell us. The Cadenza and K900 didn't have people saying they can't wait for used ones to be available before the car even released.

Kia is a very good company, and is consistently improving. In my eyes I can only see the values going up from here.

 

[orlando_dad_bod]

Marking their cars up $4k+ is one thing, but getting you out of a lease 2 years early is a completely different task and a bit of a roadblock. It really depends on how your Cadenza has held up to its residual value. If your trade-in value is anywhere near what the lease buyout would be, you may be able to get out of your lease early, but that's usually unlikely. Especially with a car that depreciates quickly like the Cadenza, and extra especially if you brought over any negative equity onto your current lease.

$14k sounds pretty high, but with 2 years left on your current lease you're likely going to need some money to get out of your lease early. Trust me, I feel you. I have 2.5 left on my lease before I can finally get a Stinger into my hands.. I'm debating on making double payments to shorten it down to a little over a year.

Yeah i hear ya. So no negative equity came into this Cadenza, but negative equity right now with lease buyout is $6000. My thought process through various calculations, and please correct me if I am wrong... (Side note, the way they wanted to do the deal is I basically buy the car outright and we work it as a trade in with the negative equity going into my next deal but see below)

$19,500 on Cadenza Trade In (My guy was going above what it should be)
$25500 on buy out
$6000 negative equity
I put $6000 down to cover negative equity
Lease rebate on Stinger is between $4200-5600.
Out the door I pay $44,000 after all fees using the rebate as my down payment.
My lease payment should be $450-500?

 

[davewg]

is the $25500 buy out the residual + remaining two years of payments? Ideally, you don't put money down on a lease.

Whats the MSRP, residual, net cap cost and term of the lease?

 

[orlando_dad_bod]

is the $25500 buy out the residual + remaining two years of payments? Ideally, you don't put money down on a lease.

Whats the MSRP, residual, net cap cost and term of the lease?

By buy out (Get a loan through my bank and refinance basically) what I mean is when I call Kia and they tell me that my lease buy out is $25.5k. Does that include the residual, I really dont know? This is all starting to confuse me. FML. Term of lease was 48 months. I am at 24 months. I think the MSRP on my Cadenza with the miles and condition KBB has it at 17k. and net cap cost? (huge sigh when I read that... because i dont know what that is)

 

[davewg]

Do you have paperwork from the Cadenza lease showing what the residual value is?
You owe, at minimum, the remaining 24 months of payments on the car. That ends the lease.

Once you've paid that you shouldn't owe anything else. The dealer or Kia financing is then free to sell the car for whatever. You have NO equity in the lease. You owe whatever the remaining lease payments are. That should be it.

If you're trying to use the Cadenza as a trade then you owe remaining lease payments + residual value (specified in your leasing contract). I don't think you want to do that since the car isn't likely worth that residual. You want to pay to get out of the lease early. Period.

Net cap cost is the negotiated price of the new car + whatever fees you're rolling in.

To be brutally honest, if you don't understand leasing terms you shouldn't lease.

 

[iclicku]

Do you have paperwork from the Cadenza lease showing what the residual value is?
You owe, at minimum, the remaining 24 months of payments on the car. That ends the lease.

Once you've paid that you shouldn't owe anything else. The dealer or Kia financing is then free to sell the car for whatever. You have NO equity in the lease. You owe whatever the remaining lease payments are. That should be it.

If you're trying to use the Cadenza as a trade then you owe remaining lease payments + residual value (specified in your leasing contract). I don't think you want to do that since the car isn't likely worth that residual. You want to pay to get out of the lease early. Period.

Net cap cost is the negotiated price of the new car + whatever fees you're rolling in.

To be brutally honest, if you don't understand leasing terms you shouldn't lease.

People aren't born knowing this stuff...at least I wasn't. Took me a while to research it and learn the process.

 

[davewg]

People aren't born knowing this stuff...at least I wasn't. Took me a while to research it and learn the process.

True. That part of my response was a little harsh...

 

[iclicku]

I understand where you're coming from. If people aren't willing to put in the leg work to figure things out and become well informed then they are asking for trouble. Those of us that do put in the effort often get impatient with those asking for "easy info" when in fact isn't.

Not implying that OP is looking for handouts. Just saying that's generally the case.

 

[davewg]

Here's what you need to know to make sure the lease deal/offer looks like it's in the ballpark

-- MSRP
-- Residual Value (this is the percent of MSRP that the car is deemed to be worth at the end of the lease. This is not negotiable as it's set by the leasing company
-- Money Factor (expressed as 5 decimals and when multiplied by 2400 gives you the interest rate of the lease)
-- Price of vehicle (negotiated purchase price)
-- Cap cost reductions (rebates applied to above)
-- Net Cap Cost is price pf vehicle - deductions + fees rolled in

From there you can calculate the monthly payment which needs to also include tax (for those states that tax leases monthly)

Leasehakr.com has an online calculator that will do the calc for you based on the above information.

Don't put $ down on a lease except maybe fees/registration if you don't want to finance those. Reason being if you drive off the lot, get hit by a bus and the car is totaled you are out whatever you paid out of pocket outside the first months payment.

Hope this helps.

 

[orlando_dad_bod]

Here's what you need to know to make sure the lease deal/offer looks like it's in the ballpark

-- MSRP
-- Residual Value (this is the percent of MSRP that the car is deemed to be worth at the end of the lease. This is not negotiable as it's set by the leasing company
-- Money Factor (expressed as 5 decimals and when multiplied by 2400 gives you the interest rate of the lease)
-- Price of vehicle (negotiated purchase price)
-- Cap cost reductions (rebates applied to above)
-- Net Cap Cost is price pf vehicle - deductions + fees rolled in

From there you can calculate the monthly payment which needs to also include tax (for those states that tax leases monthly)

Leasehakr.com has an online calculator that will do the calc for you based on the above information.

Don't put $ down on a lease except maybe fees/registration if you don't want to finance those. Reason being if you drive off the lot, get hit by a bus and the car is totaled you are out whatever you paid out of pocket outside the first months payment.

Hope this helps.

Defintely helping! I appreciate it. And I am ok with the harsh criticism. Lol. I didnt put any money down and I got the paperwork, residual value is $17,021.46.

 

[davewg]

So what you really owe to get out of the lease is you remaining payments. Monthly payment * # of months remaining.

What's the math on that?

 

[orlando_dad_bod]

420 * 24 months, so a little over 10k. Which makes sense... my guy says I would have to put about 10k down to get my payments where I want them.

 

[davewg]

Once you pay off the lease, you should be done with it. Same as if you walked away at the end of the term.

Negotiations on the Stinger should be entirely separate unless you're rolling that lease payoff chunk into the Stinger.

If it were me I'd try and treat them as separate transactions. Pay off the lease. Negotiate the stinger