1200hp Air to water intercooler Build

[7thSonEngineering]

Goal: My goal is to replace the factory intercooler with an 1200hp rated air to water intercooler that has more capacity for cooling than any intercooler on the market for the 3.3t engines. I have already completed an air to water intercooler build on my previous car which was a built automatic genesis coupe 2.0t. This build was successful and I have been running the intercooler for 2 years at this point.

Reason: Superior intercooler efficiency, better throttle response, shorter intercooler piping, less lag, turbos don't have to work as hard to create the same amount of boost and the turbos will hold boost higher into the rpm range.

Steps:
1. Mock up the 1200hp intercooler to make sure it fits in the location I have chosen.
2. Order the 1200hp rated intercooler and heat exchanger, electronics and hoses.
3. Dismantle the factory intercooler and piping system.
4. fabricate an intercooler mount.
5. Design and construct the pump speed controller
6. Install and test

I expect this build will take me 1.5 months since I have already completed something like this before.

 

[Thomby]

Your cardboard engineering skills are admirable, but why add cooling sufficient for ~double the realistic power of this engine? Versus, say, creating a set of manifolds that would allow turbo upgrades good for 700, 800, 900 horsepower...

 

[7thSonEngineering]

Your cardboard engineering skills are admirable, but why add cooling sufficient for ~double the realistic power of this engine? Versus, say, creating a set of manifolds that would allow turbo upgrades good for 700, 800, 900 horsepower...

Lol thanks!

I don’t have the manpower to design install and test new and turbos. I do have the ability to build a air to water intercooler setup for my stinger in a few weeks

In terms intercooler sizing a 1200hp ATW intercooler is so much smaller than a 1200hp ATA intercooler. If it fits why not use it ?

 

[Thomby]

I don’t have the manpower to design install and test new and turbos

Maybe I'm underestimating the work involved, I'm just surprised someone hasn't been able to build a jig that holds the stock manifold/housing in place, cut the manifold just after the point where it connects to the head, and weld together piping that places a replacement turbo in the same location as the stocker.

 

[7thSonEngineering]

Maybe I'm underestimating the work involved, I'm just surprised someone hasn't been able to build a jig that holds the stock manifold/housing in place, cut the manifold just after the point where it connects to the head, and weld together piping that places a replacement turbo in the same location as the stocker.

Yea it’s a lot of work. I think the single turbo option is the way to go and in terms of space and design.

One reason why I am building this air to water intercooler is to see how far stock turbos can be pushed. I suspect I will make 550-625 on the stocks turbos. Even if I am pushing the turbos outside of their efficiency range the oversized intercooler will cool all that hot air right back down.

Time will tell. Give me a 1.5 months to have this thing up and running.

 

[rtv900]

Goal: My goal is to replace the factory intercooler with an 1200hp rated air to water intercooler that has more capacity for cooling than any intercooler on the market for the 3.3t engines. I have already completed an air to water intercooler build on my previous car which was a built automatic genesis coupe 2.0t. This build was successful and I have been running the intercooler for 2 years at this point.

Reason: Superior intercooler efficiency, better throttle response, shorter intercooler piping, less lag, turbos don't have to work as hard to create the same amount of boost and the turbos will hold boost higher into the rpm range.

You said your air to water before was successful. Does that mean you actually tested charge air temp post cooler under the same conditions?
if so what were the results?
Like how much above ambient did you get with air to air under steady state conditions vs how much above ambient with water same boost level?

Didn't you see negative affects from the water to air issue of sitting in traffic where the liquid has no cooling so once you get going it takes 10x's longer to cool back down than air to air because you now have a gallon or two of hot water to try and get back to ambient?

I mean air to water sounds nice but in a charge cooling situation it doesn't really perform better than air to air, which is why $400k+ supercars with turbos use air to air.
Air to water is really for supercharged situations where you simply need a water heat exchanger because you are boosting directly on top of the intake so there no other practical way to do it.

 

[Thomby]

Even if I am pushing the turbos outside of their efficiency range the oversized intercooler will cool all that hot air right back down.

Inefficiency on the compressor/cold side is one possible bottleneck. Another that John/Tork seemed to think was more limiting is the backpressure on the turbine/hot side, which could cause piston & valve temps to skyrocket.

He suggested venting it by adding a fixed spring (30-35psi?) wastegate to the manifold, and had tapped it for a pressure/temp sensor, but I haven't seen any follow-up in the year since that video posted. Seems like it would be a straightforward modification, as long as you picked a spot where it fits.

 

[7thSonEngineering]

You said your air to water before was successful. Does that mean you actually tested charge air temp post cooler under the same conditions?
if so what were the results?
Like how much above ambient did you get with air to air under steady state conditions vs how much above ambient with water same boost level?

Didn't you see negative affects from the water to air issue of sitting in traffic where the liquid has no cooling so once you get going it takes 10x's longer to cool back down than air to air because you now have a gallon or two of hot water to try and get back to ambient?

I mean air to water sounds nice but in a charge cooling situation it doesn't really perform better than air to air, which is why $400k+ supercars with turbos use air to air.
Air to water is really for supercharged situations where you simply need a water heat exchanger because you are boosting directly on top of the intake so there no other practical way to do it.

What I was worried about with my previous build was

1. Does it cool the air
2. Does my big turbo spool quicker

Both of those answers are yes. Maybe 200-300rpm quicker spool and IAT under boost stayed lower fly longer.

When sitting in traffic yes IATs begin to rise but the moment the car begins moving again temps dropped back down with in 30-60 seconds

Air to water stayed ambient all conditions except boost otherwise

That build helped my small 2.0t with an oversized turbo make 470ftlb. No one with a big turbo like made that more tq than hp. Usually it’s 430hp and 376ftlb or something like that


100k + cars use air to water intercooler a starting with the Ferrari f40, McLarens, new ford GT, bmw b58/s58 motors. All the fastest cars use air to water. Bugatti and so on

 

[7thSonEngineering]

Inefficiency on the compressor/cold side is one possible bottleneck. Another that John/Tork seemed to think was more limiting is the backpressure on the turbine/hot side, which could cause piston & valve temps to skyrocket.

He suggested venting it by adding a fixed spring (30-35psi?) wastegate to the manifold, and had tapped it for a pressure/temp sensor, but I haven't seen any follow-up in the year since that video posted. Seems like it would be a straightforward modification, as long as you picked a spot where it fits.

I’ve already done all The research and came up with the best solution for this problem.

Post in thread '3.3t manifold research'

Dec 24, 2024

-Wastegate opening enlarged to 28mm
-Wastegate flapper enlarged to seal opening
-Tested with water for leaks and it’s sealed 100%

• 7thSonEngineering

• 

 

[Thomby]

I’ve already done all The research and came up with the best solution for this problem.

Any results on the car yet? Or are they not going on until you have the intercooler? I would think the real benefit would be in letting stuffed turbos like the TK700s hit their potential instead of being choked off 100+hp short of it.

 

[7thSonEngineering]

Any results on the car yet? Or are they not going on until you have the intercooler? I would think the real benefit would be in letting stuffed turbos like the TK700s hit their potential instead of being choked off 100+hp short of it.

I am a few weeks out from actually installing the intercooler. Lots of design work to do and programming

 

[7thSonEngineering]

Link to my blog post for the Air to water intercooler.

Shop Build: 1200hp Air To Water intercooler 3.3t

4/7/25 Will the Cardboard 1200hp air to water intercooler core fit? Yes it will. Time to order. 4/25/25 Air to water intercooler actual vs cardboard. Pretty much spot on Modifying the intercooler. Ditching the 3/4npt fittings for 1.5inch barb fittings. More flow = More better The pump I plan on...

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